Ends everywhere!

Soquin · Jul 1, 2011

Last month I purchase Monoi, a Carol's daughter product. Everyone has been raving about how this product has helped salvage their ends. However, my ends are still breaking off and my hair is try.

I deep condition with Dr. Miracle's protein/ deep conditioner mix. Also, I use the Monoi mask and cantu Shea butter.. Any suggestions... I would hate for all my growth to be a waste!

LuvlyRain3 · Jul 2, 2011

What's your regimen and how do you style your hair on a regular?

kittikat24 · Jul 2, 2011

I think you're getting too much protein..
When I was using cantu on the regular, I had to stop and try a new moisturiser because it gave my hair protein overload...plus, since your DC is protein (not moisture) that could be the issue as well.
You should try Silk Elements DC or ORS Replinishing pak. :yep:

ellebelle88 · Jul 2, 2011

How long and how often do you deep condition for? You have to be consistent and lay up off the heat for a while.

My Friend · Jul 2, 2011

kittikat24 said:
I think you're getting too much protein..
When I was using cantu on the regular, I had to stop and try a new moisturiser because it gave my hair protein overload...plus, since your DC is protein (not moisture) that could be the issue as well.
You should try Silk Elements DC or ORS Replinishing pak.

kittikat24

Cantu SB is a protein or protein like product?

tiffers · Jul 2, 2011

Cut out Dr. Miracle. I'd nevereverevereverever recommend their products. :nono:

Also cut out the Carol's Daughter, since it isn't working for you... plus, I hate CD and take any opportunity I can to talk crap about the products. They suck. :giggle:

Like kittikat24 said, you're getting too much protein. The Dr. Miracle is a protein, Cantu is a light protein and the Monoi line is for breakage IIRC, so that's also a protein.

Do you have any other leave-ins/moisturizers that you can use?

How often do you deep condition and for how long do you deep condition?

Try using a cholesterol from Walgreens/Walmart/CVS. Queen Helene makes awesome cholesterols that are very moisturizing and cheap.

How are you styling your hair daily?

How often do you use heat?

Natirelle · Jul 2, 2011

kittikat24 said:
I think you're getting too much protein..
When I was using cantu on the regular, I had to stop and try a new moisturiser because it gave my hair protein overload...plus, since your DC is protein (not moisture) that could be the issue as well.
You should try Silk Elements DC or ORS Replinishing pak.

ORS Replenishing Pack is a protein treatment also!

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

LuvlyRain3 said:
What's your regimen and how do you style your hair on a regular?

I wash my hair once a week with Monoi shampoo and condition with the repair mask (which is supposed to prevent breakage). I leave the repair mask on for approximately 5-7 minutes, as suggested. I also deep condition once a week with Dr. Miracles follicle healer. I don't usually use his products, but this is suppose to contain tea tree oil, aloe Vera gel, soy protein, vitamin E, B3, and C.
Main ingredients include deionized water, polysorbate 20, aloe Vera gel, hydroxy ethyl cellulose, polyquaternium-10, allantoin, wheat germ protein, panthenol, menthol glycerin acetal.....ect

On a daily basis, I condition with Cantu Shea butter leave in conditioner repair cream ( which is supposed to prevent breakage), Carol's daughters healthy hair butter, and sometimes Organic coconut oil. Although I haven't used coconut oil in about 3 weeks, my hair is still dry!

In the past week, I've added Carol's daughters hair milk and Shea moisture organic coconut and hibiscus. That's helping, but my hair is still dry. My hair is usually very soft no matter what state its in, and lately it's been hard!

Also, I haven't flat ironed or blow dried my hair in at least 2-3 months.Heat free!

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

kittikat24 said:
I think you're getting too much protein..
When I was using cantu on the regular, I had to stop and try a new moisturiser because it gave my hair protein overload...plus, since your DC is protein (not moisture) that could be the issue as well.
You should try Silk Elements DC or ORS Replinishing pak.

Where can I purchase these and approximately what is the cost? Which one do you suggest over the other? Since you've been using the Silk Elements/ ORS Replenishing pak, have you noticed a significant difference in you hair?

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

ljbee said:
How long and how often do you deep condition for? You have to be consistent and lay up off the heat for a while.

I haven't flat ironed in 2-3 months. I condition with Carol's daughter repair mask for 5-7 minutes, and I deep condition for about thirty minutes.. Wrapping a plastic cap over my head.

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

tiffers said:
Cut out Dr. Miracle. I'd nevereverevereverever recommend their products.

Also cut out the Carol's Daughter, since it isn't working for you... plus, I hate CD and take any opportunity I can to talk crap about the products. They suck.

Like kittikat24 said, you're getting too much protein. The Dr. Miracle is a protein, Cantu is a light protein and the Monoi line is for breakage IIRC, so that's also a protein.

Do you have any other leave-ins/moisturizers that you can use?

How often do you deep condition and for how long do you deep condition?

Try using a cholesterol from Walgreens/Walmart/CVS. Queen Helene makes awesome cholesterols that are very moisturizing and cheap.

How are you styling your hair daily?

How often do you use heat?

I haven't used heat in 2-3 months and don't plan to use heat for the next 9 months or so. Lately, Ive been pulling my hair back with a clip. Its not a full clip. Its basically a plastic hair piece that holds my hair in a pony-tail like manner, leaving the ends exposed to the air. If i dont use this piece, i bobby pin my hair back so that it will look like a huge curly pony tail. I just joined the "hide your length challenge," so the buns should help.

I though cantu Shea butter repair cream leave in conditioner was supposed to be a great moisturizer.

Also,
Why don't you like Carol's daughters. I thought her products were suppose to be Mostly natural and very good. I haven't tried most of them... But the hair milk curl definer is wonderful.. (the bottle is just so small!!!!)

What other shampoos and conditioners do you suggest. I just feel like there's nothing out there (that doesn't contain parabens, fragrance... Ect..)

Uggh (sigh of frustration)

Bublin · Jul 2, 2011

I say the CD is not agreeing with your hair and also if you do find yourself a new dc, i would suggest you dc for at least 30 mins to allow the product to penetrate.

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

Bublin said:
I say the CD is not agreeing with your hair and also if you do find yourself a new dc, i would suggest you dc for at least 30 mins to allow the product to penetrate.

Any suggestions for shampoos or conditioners?

tiffers · Jul 2, 2011

Soquin said:
I haven't used heat in 2-3 months and don't plan to use heat for the next 9 months or so. Lately, Ive been pulling my hair back with a clip. Its not a full clip. Its basically a plastic hair piece that holds my hair in a pony-tail like manner, leaving the ends exposed to the air. If i dont use this piece, i bobby pin my hair back so that it will look like a huge curly pony tail. I just joined the "hide your length challenge," so the buns should help.

I though cantu Shea butter repair cream leave in conditioner was supposed to be a great moisturizer.

Also,
Why don't you like Carol's daughters. I thought her products were suppose to be Mostly natural and very good. I haven't tried most of them... But the hair milk curl definer is wonderful.. (the bottle is just so small!!!!)

What other shampoos and conditioners do you suggest. I just feel like there's nothing out there (that doesn't contain parabens, fragrance... Ect..)

Uggh (sigh of frustration)

Oh, Cantu is a good moisturizer. :yep:

It just doesn't agree with some people's hair because of the protein. Maybe if you cut out the Dr. Miracle and CD, your hair would be able to better handle it.

Ugh. Carol's Daughter. I just have serious beef with those products because they're subpar and pathetically overpriced. Before she blew up, the products were actually decent. But now? Garbage. There are sooooo many better natural lines out there. Komaza, Qhemet, Enso, Hairveda, etc. Have you tried any of those? I think you'd really like them.

As far as shampoos and conditioners... lemme think... it's almost 4 am, so my brain isn't fully functional. But off the top of my head:

Neutrogena Triple Moisture Shampoo is pretty awesome. No sulfates, either. You can find it at any drug store.

And like I mentioned before, Queen Helene cholesterols are very good. My favorite is the one with ginseng. :lick:

Sally's has a GVP conditioner that's a Matrix Biolage knockoff and it's GREAT. Their HairOne (knockoff WEN) is good too. And there's a conditioner with volcanic ash in it that I thought was fantastic... Millennia Mud Mask or something like that. Really good.

Also, any Silk Elements conditioner will do you right. :giggle:

What kind of bobby pins do you use? Those could also be contributing to the problem. Ever since trying Good Hair Day Pins (also from Sally's) I've never looked back. They're so much more hair friendly than traditional bobby pins.

Have you tried baggying or oil rinsing?

When was the last time you clarified? If you have hard water, it might be time to chelate.

Bublin · Jul 2, 2011

Soquin said:
Any suggestions for shampoos or conditioners?

Yes, apologies i should have added some suggestions.

Silk Elements Moistursing treatment is excellent (we can no longer get it in the UK :sad:

)

A thick Cholestrol(sp?) - Queen Helene's is good - i use the yellow one.

For a quick but effective condition i will use Aussie Moist 3 min miracle (sometimes i add that to the Queen Helene)

Now i always mix an oil into my deep conditioners and i think it makes a huge difference and gives it that extra slip for detangling. I add Hot Six Oil. I only detangle after the dc session and add water to my hair and that makes the comb go through alot easier. The hair is somewhat stiff with just the dc in it.

For a leave-in i use Giovanni Direct Leave-in and it is the best yet for me. I seal with Coconut oil and when i comb through i do not get broken ends. I then braid up for my braid-outusing a little Cantu. No heat used at all.

Sheena · Jul 2, 2011

Most hair products that claim to repair, heal or stop breakage are protein products. It seems that you are using too many of them together. My suggestion is to stop using all of your current products temporarily and replace them with
- any shampoo that doesn't claim to do anything but cleanse the hair. Saturate your hair with olive oil and apply a plastic cap for 15 mins before shampooing your hair.
- any dc that is described as a moisture mask or pack, I like Motions Moisture Plus.
-use a few drops of jojoba or olive oil on the length of your hair daily

After 1 month, you can start adding back your products, one at a time, while paying attention to your hair so that you can determine the right mix of products for you.

I've found that when you're trying to infuse the hair with moisture, a little heat actually helps so if you aren't averse to heat and have a cap dryer available, you can dc under the dryer for 15 mins. You can also rollerset your hair and sit under the dryer for the first 20 mins and airdry the rest of the way. If you chose to use the dryer, you can apply IC leave in Moisturiser to your hair prior to rollersetting. Do not use the blowdryer!

You can vary the products suggested at your own discretion but make sure that the product you choose has little or no protein. Hope this helps.

ETA: I notice that you mentioned not using coconut oil but based on a google search, Monoi oil is coconut oil. You can do your own search or check Wikipedia

RubyWoo · Jul 2, 2011

Natirel Me ! said:
ORS Replenishing Pack is a protein treatment also!

No it is not. It is very much a deep conditioner. The only protiens in ors replenishing conditioner are proteins that help soften(amino silk acid/silk proteins) the hair and provide elasticity(collagen). On the description it states it's purpose which includes moisturizing and softening to the hair. Many deep conditioners have proteins in them; however, their purpose is to contribute to adding moisture to the hair and they are usually in small quantity. Usually the types of proteins, how much protein in addition to the description on the bottle will reveal if a product is a protein treatment or a deep conditioner..

I've ben using ors replenishing conditioner for about 4 years as my deep conditioner and it has always made my hair extremely soft. I most definitely cosign that recommendation..

kupenda · Jul 2, 2011

Monoi is most definitely coconut oil lol. It's just infused with a flower or something. So actually you're using coconut oil. A lot of it. Keep DCing but use one that is strictly moisturizing. I lovvee Hairveda's Sitrinillah. It also has coconut oil tho. I like coconut oil but only when it's warm out. It seems to work better. Maybe that will help

Sent from my iPhone using LHCF

Pompous Blue · Jul 2, 2011

kupenda said:
Monoi is most definitely coconut oil lol. It's just infused with a flower or something. So actually you're using coconut oil. A lot of it. Keep DCing but use one that is strictly moisturizing. I lovvee Hairveda's Sitrinillah. It also has coconut oil tho. I like coconut oil but only when it's warm out. It seems to work better. Maybe that will help

Sent from my iPhone using LHCF

She's right. Monoi is coconut oil. I can't use it to seal or sit on my hair for any length of time because it dries it out. Coconut oil makes my hair dry and rough. The only time I use coconut oil is to coat my scalp and hair for a henna treatment.

Here's a recent thread about coconut oil.

http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=553931&highlight=coconut+oil

Hope this helps.

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

Bublin said:
I say the CD is not agreeing with your hair and also if you do find yourself a new dc, i would suggest you dc for at least 30 mins to allow the product to penetrate.

Ok. Thanks

will do

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

Bublin said:
Yes, apologies i should have added some suggestions.

Silk Elements Moistursing treatment is excellent (we can no longer get it in the UK )

A thick Cholestrol(sp?) - Queen Helene's is good - i use the yellow one.

For a quick but effective condition i will use Aussie Moist 3 min miracle (sometimes i add that to the Queen Helene)

Now i always mix an oil into my deep conditioners and i think it makes a huge difference and gives it that extra slip for detangling. I add Hot Six Oil. I only detangle after the dc session and add water to my hair and that makes the comb go through alot easier. The hair is somewhat stiff with just the dc in it.

For a leave-in i use Giovanni Direct Leave-in and it is the best yet for me. I seal with Coconut oil and when i comb through i do not get broken ends. I then braid up for my braid-outusing a little Cantu. No heat used at all.

Queen Helene seems to be popular. What is the purpose of the cholesterol for our hair?

And I will try the Giovanni Direct leave in

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

tiffers said:
Oh, Cantu is a good moisturizer. It just doesn't agree with some people's hair because of the protein. Maybe if you cut out the Dr. Miracle and CD, your hair would be able to better handle it.

Ugh. Carol's Daughter. I just have serious beef with those products because they're subpar and pathetically overpriced. Before she blew up, the products were actually decent. But now? Garbage. There are sooooo many better natural lines out there. Komaza, Qhemet, Enso, Hairveda, etc. Have you tried any of those? I think you'd really like them.

As far as shampoos and conditioners... lemme think... it's almost 4 am, so my brain isn't fully functional. But off the top of my head:

Neutrogena Triple Moisture Shampoo is pretty awesome. No sulfates, either. You can find it at any drug store.

And like I mentioned before, Queen Helene cholesterols are very good. My favorite is the one with ginseng.

Sally's has a GVP conditioner that's a Matrix Biolage knockoff and it's GREAT. Their HairOne (knockoff WEN) is good too. And there's a conditioner with volcanic ash in it that I thought was fantastic... Millennia Mud Mask or something like that. Really good.

Also, any Silk Elements conditioner will do you right.

What kind of bobby pins do you use? Those could also be contributing to the problem. Ever since trying Good Hair Day Pins (also from Sally's) I've never looked back. They're so much more hair friendly than traditional bobby pins.

Have you tried baggying or oil rinsing?

When was the last time you clarified? If you have hard water, it might be time to chelate.

Thank you so much, and I didn't realize how uneducated I was about the things I should do to my hair.
What is baggying and what do you mean by "clarified"?

I've never heard of Komaza, hairveda... Or any of the other names you mentioned

And Carol's daughters prices are ridiculous. I paid $9 for a 2oz bottle of hairmilk. Ridiculous!

Silk Elements seems to be popular and queen Helene's.

Where can I find these natural products? I have never seem them.

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

Sheena said:
Most hair products that claim to repair, heal or stop breakage are protein products. It seems that you are using too many of them together. My suggestion is to stop using all of your current products temporarily and replace them with
- any shampoo that doesn't claim to do anything but cleanse the hair. Saturate your hair with olive oil and apply a plastic cap for 15 mins before shampooing your hair.
- any dc that is described as a moisture mask or pack, I like Motions Moisture Plus.
-use a few drops of jojoba or olive oil on the length of your hair daily

After 1 month, you can start adding back your products, one at a time, while paying attention to your hair so that you can determine the right mix of products for you.

I've found that when you're trying to infuse the hair with moisture, a little heat actually helps so if you aren't averse to heat and have a cap dryer available, you can dc under the dryer for 15 mins. You can also rollerset your hair and sit under the dryer for the first 20 mins and airdry the rest of the way. If you chose to use the dryer, you can apply IC leave in Moisturiser to your hair prior to rollersetting. Do not use the blowdryer!

You can vary the products suggested at your own discretion but make sure that the product you choose has little or no protein. Hope this helps.

ETA: I notice that you mentioned not using coconut oil but based on a google search, Monoi oil is coconut oil. You can do your own search or check Wikipedia

Thanks. I did stop using coconut oil. But, on every site I look at, they claim that coconut oil is the only oil that penetrates the hair. Lately it hasn't been working for me though.

Soquin · Jul 2, 2011

Pompous Blue said:
She's right. Monoi is coconut oil. I can't use it to seal or sit on my hair for any length of time because it dries it out. Coconut oil makes my hair dry and rough. The only time I use coconut oil is to coat my scalp and hair for a henna treatment.

Here's a recent thread about coconut oil.

http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=553931&highlight=coconut+oil

Hope this helps.

Thanks it did! No more coconut oil for me.

Is it ok to mix differed brands of shampoo and conditioner?

LuvlyRain3 · Jul 2, 2011

Soquin said:
I wash my hair once a week with Monoi shampoo and condition with the repair mask (which is supposed to prevent breakage). I leave the repair mask on for approximately 5-7 minutes, as suggested. I also deep condition once a week with Dr. Miracles follicle healer. I don't usually use his products, but this is suppose to contain tea tree oil, aloe Vera gel, soy protein, vitamin E, B3, and C.
Main ingredients include deionized water, polysorbate 20, aloe Vera gel, hydroxy ethyl cellulose, polyquaternium-10, allantoin, wheat germ protein, panthenol, menthol glycerin acetal.....ect

On a daily basis, I condition with Cantu Shea butter leave in conditioner repair cream ( which is supposed to prevent breakage), Carol's daughters healthy hair butter, and sometimes Organic coconut oil. Although I haven't used coconut oil in about 3 weeks, my hair is still dry!

In the past week, I've added Carol's daughters hair milk and Shea moisture organic coconut and hibiscus. That's helping, but my hair is still dry. My hair is usually very soft no matter what state its in, and lately it's been hard!

Also, I haven't flat ironed or blow dried my hair in at least 2-3 months.Heat free!

I honestly dont think too highly of CD hair products. I suggest you try a different type of protein treatment. Maybe aphogee 2min or nexxus emergencee. Then I would use a very moisturizing DC. How long do you DC for??

I also wouldn't use Cantu leave in everyday. Do you have any moisturizers or leave ins that are moisturizing? Have you examined your ends? When was the last time you trimmed?

KiWiStyle · Jul 2, 2011

I'm no hair expert but from what I've learned in the last 6 months is; you are using way too much protein. You should be using a DC without protein following the CD Monoi protein treatment but for now you should strictly use conditioners and moisturizers without protein to balance all that protein.

Pompous Blue · Jul 2, 2011

Soquin said:
Thank you so much, and I didn't realize how uneducated I was about the things I should do to my hair.
What is baggying and what do you mean by "clarified"?

I've never heard of Komaza, hairveda... Or any of the other names you mentioned

Where can I find these natural products? I have never seem them.

Baggying is applying a plastic cap/shower cap on your head and leaving it for a length of time to infuse moisture into your hair. Some people do not apply products to their hair before baggying. They let the natural sebum work for them. I've tried baggying and it irritated me (don't like hearing that crunch sound while trying to sleep). To infuse moisture into my strands, I use steam (I have a steamer).

I started out my healthy hair journey by using a clarifying shampoo. There are a lot of them out there and maybe someone can make some recommendations. But, I wanted to start using natural products and now use Rhassoul or Bentonite clay to clarify my hair instead of a commercial clarifying shampoo. I clarify about twice a month and have noticed a marked improvement in my ends. In the past, when my ends began to feel rough and a clarifying shampoo did not help, I would do a dusting. Now I don't have to dust as frequently 'cause the clay does a very good job of keeping my ends smooth and accentuate my curls.

I love Hairveda.com, Komazahaircare.com, shescentit.com, Oyinhandmade.com, and other natural hair care companies. Visit the vendor forum. There are lots of natural hair care and commercial hair care vendors listed along with reviews and upcoming sales.

Soquin said:
Thanks. I did stop using coconut oil. But, on every site I look at, they claim that coconut oil is the only oil that penetrates the hair. Lately it hasn't been working for me though.

If I need to use an oil that penetrates, I use meadowfoam seed oil I bought from fromnaturewithlove.com during a sale....I see it's still on sale!

http://fromnaturewithlove.com/specials.asp#hydrosols

Meadowfoam Seed Oil - SAVE 30%
Meadowfoam Seed Oil is said to moisturize the skin and hair better than most oils, and it helps prevent moisture loss.

Soquin said:
Thanks it did! No more coconut oil for me.

Is it ok to mix differed brands of shampoo and conditioner?

I do. But read the labels and do a lot more reading of various topics on this forum to find out what works and what only gives mediocre results.

Hope I wasn't too chatty......

Myjourney2009 · Jul 2, 2011

My Friend said:
kittikat24

Cantu SB is a protein or protein like product?

It is not a protein product, most moisturizing products will have a small amount of protein to help the mositurizing ingredients adhere to the hair.

If you hair does not need it dont use it every day.

Myjourney2009 · Jul 2, 2011

Soquin said:
Queen Helene seems to be popular. What is the purpose of the cholesterol for our hair?

And I will try the Giovanni Direct leave in

Cholesterol is a fat it helps the hair strands hold on to moisture, not quite as much as protein but more than just a straight moisturizing conditioner.

Myjourney2009 · Jul 2, 2011

RubyWoo said:
No it is not. It is very much a deep conditioner. The only protiens in ors replenishing conditioner are proteins that help soften(amino silk acid/silk proteins) the hair and provide elasticity(collagen). On the description it states it's purpose which includes moisturizing and softening to the hair. Many deep conditioners have proteins in them; however, their purpose is to contribute to adding moisture to the hair and they are usually in small quantity. Usually the types of proteins, how much protein in addition to the description on the bottle will reveal if a product is a protein treatment or a deep conditioner..

I've ben using ors replenishing conditioner for about 4 years as my deep conditioner and it has always made my hair extremely soft. I most definitely cosign that recommendation..

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