Now Forming an Army of SUPER-LONG HAIR 4B (or mostly 4b) NATURALS!! Come on in!

Thanks AlmondEyes. I will do some more research when I get home. This sounds interesting.

stephanie75miller said:

Thanks AlmondEyes. I will do some more research when I get home. This sounds interesting.

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Let me know. I have been trying to figure out this link between sebum, preening, water rinsing, diet etc.



Best,
Almond Eyes

almond eyes said:

Preening is the process by which you gently smooth your hair down from your scalp to your ends. The process is to activate the sebum. I don't do it hard but you can check out how the youtube from water rinsing only does it. She has longer hair though and my hair is about three inches. I do not follow her instructions to the core because I still shampoo and conditioner wash weekly (I started going back to this again) but I daily rinse my hair with water in the shower since I am high porosity. But I do think that preening is useful. But there is something about the process of preening on a daily basis that helps. Some women preen on dry hair. I preen in the shower after my water rinse. I suppose for women who are low porosity preening can be done on dry hair just do not tug violently or pull your hair down too rough. A good diet is also important to activating the sebum glands. Many Asian women eat lots of kelp and green leafy vegetables. Sebum producing veggies. I also think that eating lots of beans, legumes and veggies are key to better sebum because when I lived in Rwanda, that was the main diet and I didn't see many of the women there with dry hair. And they washed their hair more often. Sebum will not make your hair curlier or change it's texture unless your hair was dry from not treating it well but it will allow your oil glands to give better moisture to your hair which is key to retention and better styling options. Best, Almond Eyes

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thank you! very interesting . maymbe this is a key indeed to retention (my aunt does it and almost has no products at all.... and she is a wl natural 4b as i said before)

im gonna search more for this. very interesting!

I have been on a super low manipulation regimen and I love it. I'm losing way less hair (breakage/shedding). As crazy as it sounds I am only washing my hair once a month. My goal os to maintain thickness as my hair grows out. Weekly washing was just too much for me. My hair seemed thinner after every wash.

I guess I have been unintentionally preening all along! I massage my scalp and gently work the natural oils down the length of my hair. It pretty much keeps my strands moisturized and protected. If I do too much preening my hair is too oily

coolsista-paris said:

thank you! very interesting . maymbe this is a key indeed to retention (my aunt does it and almost has no products at all.... and she is a wl natural 4b as i said before)

im gonna search more for this. very interesting!

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Most welcome. Perhaps it is all so simple after all if we exercise patience.
When my hair gets longer, I am only going to use some grease or light oils on my shaft and ends.

My hair is still getting used to this preening and water rinsing and less product but I am more committed to stick with it. I wish I had never relaxed my hair in the first place, my hair when I was younger without relaxer was of such a different quality than now. I believe that relaxers can ruin the quality of your follicles and it can take months and years to repair and for women with fine hair the damage is more obvious which is why when some women stop relaxing their hair they wonder why their hair is still so dry and wiry.

I wanted to add that I think preening is best done in the shower after you have sufficiently wet it, conditioned or shampooed and conditioned it, I think that the sweating and massaging your hair in the shower pushes those oils downward when you use your hands or comb/brush. I think by the way, preening is detangling too with a comb or brush. Meaning you can detangle in the shower with your comb or brush and the oils come down this way too. Preening on dry hair doesn't work for me my sebum has to be activated by the sweating and massaging in the shower with the warm water and to make sure the sebum gets sufficiently to the rest of my hair I have to lightly comb my hair out with the water but do not use very hot water, warm water will do.

For some women depending upon the health of your scalp it could take weeks to at least a year I believe to get total sebum coverage. I also think that if you have an oily scalp to begin with it is easier than if you have a dry scalp. My scalp is not dry nor is it oily but my hair is medium porosity in all areas of my hair except my front hair and I attribute this to years of over processing and tight braiding in that area that irritated my scalp.

Best,
Almond Eyes

Prettymetty said:

I guess I have been unintentionally preening all along! I massage my scalp and gently work the natural oils down the length of my hair. It pretty much keeps my strands moisturized and protected. If I do too much preening my hair is too oily

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How long have you been preening and how long did it take you to get full sebum coverage?

Best,
Almond Eyes

almond eyes said:

How long have you been preening and how long did it take you to get full sebum coverage?

Best,
Almond Eyes

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I get full coverage after about 5 days. I have been preening daily since October.

Double post :/

Prettymetty said:

I get full coverage after about 5 days. I have been preening daily since October.

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Did you have an oily scalp to begin with and possibly not know it?. What was your routine to bring about an oily scalp?

Very few Afro haired women have dry scalps unless their has been some damage or ezcema or something else. I believe most Afro haired women have normal sebum levels but dry strands because the sebum has a difficult time making it all the way down to the curls.

Best,
Almond Eyes

My problem is that my sebum doesn't make it all the way to the rest of my hair especially in the front which causes dryness in those strands. While I think preening and water rinsing everyday is good, I think it is important to treat the hair gently and not use excessively hot water nor grab or pull on my hair too rough because that can create hair loss if not careful.

I suspect the woman who is the youtuber from water rinsing only had an oily scalp to begin with and her stimulating it more helped the sebum production. I think for women who have dry scalps due to relaxer damage or other issues, water rinsing only may not help. Sebum may have to be assisted by adding something like a light oil to the hair (and not the scalp) to ensure that the hair doesn't get dry and parched.


If you have a scalp which produces normal levels of oil but you have dry strands, you have to make sure to keep a balance with treating your scalp very well and not clogging it up with products but also ensuring that your strands are well moisturized. Again for me, because my hair is fine, I cannot do excessive hair products so I tend to rinse my hair in the shower more which keeps my tangles at bay and allows me to retain length since I am not able to protective style yet.

Best,

Almond Eyes

almond eyes said:

Did you have an oily scalp to begin with and possibly not know it?. What was your routine to bring about an oily scalp?

Very few Afro haired women have dry scalps unless their has been some damage or ezcema or something else. I believe most Afro haired women have normal sebum levels but dry strands because the sebum has a difficult time making it all the way down to the curls.

Best,
Almond Eyes

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My scalp is usually dry this time of year, but massaging it produces more sebum...I think. Before I started preening I would get scalp flakes and I had to do hot oil treatments. Now my scalp is too oily. I need to find the perfect balance

almond eyes said:

My problem is that my sebum doesn't make it all the way to the rest of my hair especially in the front which causes dryness in those strands. While I think preening and water rinsing everyday is good, I think it is important to treat the hair gently and not use excessively hot water nor grab or pull on my hair too rough because that can create hair loss if not careful. I suspect the woman who is the youtuber from water rinsing only had an oily scalp to begin with and her stimulating it more helped the sebum production. I think for women who have dry scalps due to relaxer damage or other issues, water rinsing only may not help. Sebum may have to be assisted by adding something like a light oil to the hair (and not the scalp) to ensure that the hair doesn't get dry and parched. If you have a scalp which produces normal levels of oil but you have dry strands, you have to make sure to keep a balance with treating your scalp very well and not clogging it up with products but also ensuring that your strands are well moisturized. Again for me, because my hair is fine, I cannot do excessive hair products so I tend to rinse my hair in the shower more which keeps my tangles at bay and allows me to retain length since I am not able to protective style yet. Best, Almond Eyes

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as ive also got fine hair i should try our more rinsing . water then sealing

coolsista-paris said:

as ive also got fine hair i should try our more rinsing . water then sealing

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Water and then sealing is a good idea. I think just water only without sealing or product can leave the hair feeling dry. I also think it is not a good idea to stay longer than 15 minutes under the shower head to prevent weakening of your hair strands. Since you are doing a long term transition I would take it easy with the water rinsing and only rinse your hair for five minutes and make sure all your strands are saturated. I rinse my hair for only five minutes, shower cap to get the co2 effect and then rinse out again for another three minutes. You don't have to follow my method.

I tried water rinsing and no product and while my hair felt soft for a few hours by morning the next day it was a bit dry. When I rinsed my hair again the hair felt soft again as the water revived the softness. I started to go back to using a leave in after my water rinse. I was using s curl but I find that that made my hair feel very greasy but I think the product can be saved by adding some aloe juice and more water. I have been using Komaza califa leave in moisturiser. I like it, it really traps that water in from the water rinse and my hair stays soft until morning. I never really gave thought about this issue of the ph and products but I am learning more and more about my hair. Water has a ph which is between a 5-7 depending on whether you have hard water or not. So if your water is hard, water rinsing without a leave in which balances it all out will lead to hard hair in that case you would need to use a water filter.

And it is important if you have highly porous hair or fine hair to use a protein treatment once a week after your shampoo that will help your hair to retain the water and the leave in for longer periods of time. But the key is not to use a protein treatment that is going to make your hair rock hard. You must use a moisturizer conditioner after that. The protein treatment should contain some key words in the ingredients that let you know it is a real protein treatment if not you are wasting your money.

Best,
Almond Eyes

I need to go ahead and buy another bottle of Keracare Humecto. I tried to sub it for Silk Elements moisturizing treatment, but it isn't the same. Humecto softens, hydrates and detangles. Silk Elements is so thick that it just sits on the hair.

I agree about the protein. Took me a year into my hhj to figure out reconstructors are more critical than hard protein. I also learned that just simply leaving the reconstructor on longer serves as a hard treatment as well.

Seasons play a role too. My mini setbacks happen in winter due to dry air. Dry air is dry hair. Getting the moisture balance is a challenge when there's no moisture in the air. My skin suffers too. Still working on it . My Spring and summer reggis are in point though.

DarkJoy said:

I agree about the protein. Took me a year into my hhj to figure out reconstructors are more critical than hard protein. I also learned that just simply leaving the reconstructor on longer serves as a hard treatment as well.

Seasons play a role too. My mini setbacks happen in winter due to dry air. Dry air is dry hair. Getting the moisture balance is a challenge when there's no moisture in the air. My skin suffers too. Still working on it . My Spring and summer reggis are in point though.

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I agree with you fully.

Best,
Almond Eyes

About 5 weeks in to daily rinsing. Still preening nightly for a good 15 to 20 minutes (dry) and again in the shower). I'm generating more and more sebum with diligence (probably 3/4 of my hair is nicely covered now). Had to create a concoction for the ends, and my ends seems to think it's sebum (yay).

By the way AlmondEyes, ITA about having had a perm destroying hair follicles. It has been 20 years since my last perm, and my hair was BONE dry up until recently (the ends are still struggling along with the help of my little experiment). But I am here to tell you that I can SEE the difference after almost 5 weeks of DAILY committed effort. It's not easy to find the time and sometimes, I'm up late because I have tons of other stuff to get done before I go to bed. But I am DETERMINED that before I leave this earth to have SUPER LONG 4 B hair. If this is the price I have to pay, I'm forking over my wallet. I've been dancing around trying to get some hair for 20 years post perm and by gosh, I'm going to will it to happen with God's help.

I have discovered that my expensive de-tangling Mason Pearson brush is actually AWESOME in the shower. After using the wide tooth comb in sections, I start at the ends with my brush and move on on up. Hardly any hair combs out and what does is "end of life hair". Because my hair feels so silky, I'm back to wetting all of it daily. Now I understand the meaning of "listen to your hair". So, I'm back to parting it in 4 even sections.



Another thing I found was clipping my hair flat against my head while hair is soaking wet, then wrap it up and go to bed. In the morning combing though it a DREAM as hair is stretched to the max but slightly moist so it is manageable.

Also, I switched from condish to something natural: Xanthum gum. It is the slickest ever. Love it. 1 tsp to 8oz wather does one wash. CHEAP.

My hair is getting better and better. I'm a taking videos of my journey and plan to launch a YouTube Chanel January 2016 for the big reveal.

CenteredGirl said:

Adding nightly preening and head massage to the routine. Find that I don't need as much condish on my ends when I do this. Getting better and better! God is good

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Seriously, what's the best tool to detangle 4c hair.
Not interesting about finger detangling as it takes too long.

Krystle~Hime said:

Seriously, what's the best tool to detangle 4c hair.
Not interesting about finger detangling as it takes too long.

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I use a wide tooth comb and afterwards I use a rat tail comb (medium teeth). I don't like brushes at all, but lots of ladies have success with the Denman.

You end up using 2 different tools. Have you ever try finding your 2 in 1 lover ?
Prettymetty


I'm gonna give a try to tangle teezer. I have a michel mercier detangling brush but idont like it that much.

I usually just use my wide tooth comb. If I have lots of tangles/shed hair I go through with a smaller comb. It depends on how long I go in between washes.

I've been washing/rinsing my hair 3 times a week and I'm liking it. My roots feel good and the rest of my hair feels nice and springy. In wear my hair in two strand twists 90-98% of the time so ib haven't been able to fully assess the benefits of regular wetting.

One thing I've done was cut out the heavy sealing and stuck with a light oil so that I don't get much build up.

I'll try 3 days for another week or two then I might brave it and move up to daily wetting.

snoop said:

I've been washing/rinsing my hair 3 times a week and I'm liking it. My roots feel good and the rest of my hair feels nice and springy. In wear my hair in two strand twists 90-98% of the time so ib haven't been able to fully assess the benefits of regular wetting.

One thing I've done was cut out the heavy sealing and stuck with a light oil so that I don't get much build up.

I'll try 3 days for another week or two then I might brave it and move up to daily wetting.

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Thanks for the updates on daily wetting.

Daily wetting and then using a leave in has been working for me. As I have been learning more from my hair my hair likes a light leave in because it is still trying to gain length.

I still do my shampoo, protein and moisturizing conditioners weekly. I like the daily wetting because it helps me keep my moisture in since I am unable to grab my hair into a protective style like big braids. I actually can at the moment because my hair is about three inches stretched but I refuse to tax my hair like that. I also think it helps to keep the tangles at bay to daily wet in the shower. My hair is too dense and highly porous to just use a spritz bottle. I finger detangle before I get into the shower. I have this trick when I get to a small fairy knot I rubber my thumb and first fingers together over the knot hair lightly at the bottom and the knot unloosens and if it still gives problems I use a larger section of hair and lightly rub that together from the bottom with that knotted section and it unloosens the knot. Sometimes I detangle my hair is the shower but I cannot do the finger loosening the knot when the hair is wet.

When I am able to protectively style I will still wet in the shower but in big braids and probably three times a week.

Best,
Almond Eyes

almond eyes said:

Remember be wary of leave ins with proteins that may not interact the best on high porosity hairs like some gels

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almond eyes, I've seen you say this a few times. Why? I thought protein (in general, meaning whichever you hair likes) was good for hi po hair. I thought it filled in missing bits of the cuticle.

Krystle~Hime said:

I'm gonna give a try to tangle teezer.

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Krystle~Hime, Girl, NOOOOOOO!!!!! People were reporting all kinda mid-strand splits, tree splits, it was a hair horror show. Save yourself, chile!

Lol ok what do you suggest then Honey Bee

Krystle~Hime said:

Lol ok what do you suggest then

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Idk, I'm still transitioning my daggone self. I finger detangle... which you said you weren't interested in.

You could try seamless combs. I have the whole set from hotcombs.net (magic rake, etc) and I noticed a difference almost immediately. My mom loves them too and her hair was even more delicate than mine at the time (undiagnosed thyroid issue). My hair improved immensely once I got them and, tbh, I thought the combs I had before were just fine. Shows how much I know.

Honey Bee said:

almond eyes, I've seen you say this a few times. Why? I thought protein (in general, meaning whichever you hair likes) was good for hi po hair. I thought it filled in missing bits of the cuticle.


Krystle~Hime, Girl, NOOOOOOO!!!!! People were reporting all kinda mid-strand splits, tree splits, it was a hair horror show. Save yourself, chile!

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Hi. Yes, I have said this a few times. I think porous and fine porous hair likes protein but in a protein treatment that needs to be washed out. When it is a leave in it can leave the hair feeling hard and that can cause dryness. Protein leave in, in my opinion is over kill though there are some natural products which act as a mild protein and that is fine for your hair. Something like aloe is like a mild protein and that works for my hair as long as it is not alone and mixed with other products and is not in a gel form which is too sticky for my hair like glycerin. If the leave in makes your hair feel hard I would leave it alone but if it is working for you then continue with it. My hair usually will tell me immediately when I use something on her and if she doesn't like it she rejects it immediately.

Best,
Almond Eyes

Honey Bee said:

Idk, I'm still transitioning my daggone self. I finger detangle... which you said you weren't interested in.

You could try seamless combs. I have the whole set from hotcombs.net (magic rake, etc) and I noticed a difference almost immediately. My mom loves them too and her hair was even more delicate than mine at the time (undiagnosed thyroid issue). My hair improved immensely once I got them and, tbh, I thought the combs I had before were just fine. Shows how much I know.

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I have a comb from bone sense that I have had forever, but I will give one of the hot comb seamless detangle rakers a go since I detangle a lot on my natural wet hair. Thanks.

Best,
Almond Eyes

almond eyes said:

Hi. Yes, I have said this a few times. I think porous and fine porous hair likes protein but in a protein treatment that needs to be washed out. When it is a leave in it can leave the hair feeling hard and that can cause dryness. Protein leave in, in my opinion is over kill though there are some natural products which act as a mild protein and that is fine for your hair. Something like aloe is like a mild protein and that works for my hair as long as it is not alone and mixed with other products and is not in a gel form which is too sticky for my hair like glycerin. If the leave in makes your hair feel hard I would leave it alone but if it is working for you then continue with it. My hair usually will tell me immediately when I use something on her and if she doesn't like it she rejects it immediately.

Best,
Almond Eyes

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The size of the protein molecules probably makes a difference as well. My hair dislikes aloe, shea, and coconut oil. However, I've found that silk peptidesas part of my leave in has really helped my hair by eliminating all sorts of splits (mid strand, split ends, etc.) But to Almond Eyes' point, it's very low on the ingredient list so maybe my hair reacts the same to it as it would a protein that had been rinsed out. ...?