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6 Year Old Arrested For Having Tantrum At School

Evolving78

Well-Known Member
I didn't know the officer is black.

He didn't have to arrest her.

Let me ask ya'll
If the little girl is kicking people and tearing up the place, How should the staff have handled it?
Call the parents, get the dean, school social worker, resource teacher, and or school psychologist. Also the girl may need to be evaluated due to her medical condition.
 

LivingInPeace

Well-Known Member
who knows why he
Call the parents, get the dean, school social worker, resource teacher, and or school psychologist. Also the girl may need to be evaluated due to her medical condition.
But during the time that you’re calling and waiting for the parents, what do you do with the child? I’ve never worked in a school and this isn’t something that I ever witnessed as a student. So I’m genuinely curious. I don’t know what you do when children get physical.
 

HappilyLiberal

Well-Known Member
But during the time that you’re calling and waiting for the parents, what do you do with the child? I’ve never worked in a school and this isn’t something that I ever witnessed as a student. So I’m genuinely curious. I don’t know what you do when children get physical.

You remove the child from the classroom until those other resources can arrive. There's the nurse's office and the school counselor's office. And, removing the child from the stimulant (classroom) will likely result in her starting to calm down which would make police intervention unnecessary in the first place!
 
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Evolving78

Well-Known Member
But during the time that you’re calling and waiting for the parents, what do you do with the child? I’ve never worked in a school and this isn’t something that I ever witnessed as a student. So I’m genuinely curious. I don’t know what you do when children get physical.
That’s why you get trained professionals involved. Those people should be in the building to assist such matters. I have been through those types of experiences. And that’s why it is best to have an emergency contact that is nearby. I’m very close, within 5-7 mins because of my children’s conditions. That’s something parents with children with such conditions need to consider. And it is best to have a behavioral plan in place for things of that nature. That’s where getting the child evaluated for an IEP, or 504 plan is a perfect start. Children with asthma, allergies, autoimmune conditions have those in place, especially when they can’t verbally communicate properly at the time of a crisis. Those plans are not just for children with special needs.
 

dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
Call the parents, get the dean, school social worker, resource teacher, and or school psychologist. Also the girl may need to be evaluated due to her medical condition.

It is an elementary school so no psychologists, no dean, no counselor, and no social worker.
My kids had none of those things at their high performing highly rated elementary school.

Nah. That’s standard..

No it's not.
 
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dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
You remove the child from the classroom until those other resources can arrive. There's the nurse's office and the school counselor's office. And, removing the child from the stimulant (classroom) will likely result in her starting the calm down which would make police intervention unnecessary in the first place!

I am a nurse and what exactly do you want me to do with a kicking and screaming child while the parents aren't answering the phone or haven't made it up there yet to get their kid? :eek:
Please enlighten me because we aren't trained to deal with tantrums.

In real life parents don't answer the phone because they know you are calling about their bad behaving child.
 
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Evolving78

Well-Known Member
It is an elementary school so no psychologists, no dean, no counselor, and no social worker.
My kids had none of those things at their high performing highly rated elementary school.
Then if a school doesn’t provide those things, a child would need to be pulled out and put into a school that can, or even get into a homeschool program with a small number of students. And I’m sorry I’m unaware of a school not providing those things unless it is a private school that doesn’t use their private funding to provide support and resources for children with such issues. A school district that accepts funding from the government has to provide the most least restricted environment for children with such issues, so what happens to the children that perform well academically, but may have other conditions or issues? You pull them out, or you pay for a paraprofessional for your children.
 
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Reinventing21

Spreading my wings
In public schools there are staff members, who have been specifically and formally trained on how to legally restrain a child. These may include teachers, security and other staff.

If a young child is physically out of control, one or more of those trained staff is called to restrain the child. Public schools also have part time or full time psychologist and social worker who are usually there to help deescalate along with Special Ed. teachers who are also trained (and very good at it) to deescalate.The parents are informed and if necessary the parents may decide to take them home. It is not always necessary, and the goal is usually to keep the child in school except in cases where a child harms another child.

That said, I don't know about charter and private schools as their rules and regulations are different.

Arresting a child for a tantrum is deplorable. I do hope however, that the child with insomnia issues gets more help as that is not healthy for the developing brain. If her health issues were not documented with clear instructions in the school system, then her family needs to do that ASAP while she works with the little girl.

Some people can handle insomnia well and never seem to have ill side effects. Others, though, can become potentially violent. Just like with other mental health disorders, some people can have hallucinations and never hurt a fly, while others...
 
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Evolving78

Well-Known Member
I am a nurse and what exactly do you want me to do with a kicking and screaming child while the parents aren't answering the phone or haven't made it up there yet to get their kid? :eek:
Please enlighten me because we aren't trained to deal with tantrums.

In real life parents don't answer the phone because they know you are calling about their bad behaving child.
Wow. See the nursing staff at my children’s schools have been wonderful and established a great relationship with mine and the other students. The nurses were part of my children’s intervention plans. I do understand that there are parents that don’t answer the phone. My children are in elementary school and middle school. I empathize with staff members about dealing with children with troubling issues.
 

dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
Then if a school doesn’t provide those things, a child would need to be pulled out in a school that can, or even get into a homeschool program with a small number of students. And I’m sorry I’m unaware of a school not providing those things unless it is a private school that doesn’t use their private funding to provide support and resources for children with such issues. A school distreict that accepts funding from the government has to provide the most least restricted environment for children with such issues, so what happens to the children that perform well academically, but may have other conditions or issues? You pull them out right, or you pay for a paraprofessional for your children.

Houston elementary magnets schools do not provide those services. There are special education teachers and a speech pathologist and that about it.
 

dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
In public schools there are staff members, who have been specifically and formally trained on how to legally restrain a child. These may include teachers, security and other staff.

If a young child is physically out of control, one or more of those trained staff are called to restrain the child. Public schools also have part time or full time psychologist and social worker who are usually there to help deescalate along with Special Ed. teachers who are also trained (and very good at it) to deescalate.The parents are informed and if necessary the parents may decide to take them home. It is not always necessary, and the goal is usually to keep the child in school except in cases where a child harms another child.

That said, I don't know about charter and private schools as their rules and regulations are different.

Arresting a child for a tantrum is deplorable. I do hope however, that the child with insomnia issues gets more help as that is not healthy for the developing brain. If her health issues were not documented with clear instructions in the school system, then she needs to do that ASAP while she works with the little girl.

Some people can handle insomnia well and never seem to have ill side effects. Others, though, can become potentially violent. Just like with other mental health disorders, some people can have hallucinations and never hurt a fly, while others...

Also not true about staff being trained to properly restrain kids.
At my kids school a black and white kid both had tantrums and tore the class room up. Principal tried to restrain the black kid and was kicked. Black kid was expelled. New rule implemented that staff can't touch the kids. White kid tears class room up the next year and no one touched him. Everyone exited the room and he pulled down a book shelf. He got to stay because he had an IEP.
 

LivingInPeace

Well-Known Member
I don’t know how people manage to teach/work in schools now. I feel like too much is being demanded of teachers. You’re supposed to accept being hit by students who are often larger than you. From what I’ve heard from teachers, you’re supposed to pass students who have never done their homework.
What is the solution?
 

Mitzi

Well-Known Member
[QUOTE="Evolving78, post: 25323437, member: 2496] And I see an office come to the school and pull up children’s registration records and pull children out of class all of the time.[/QUOTE]

Did they return to class? I'm also wondering if those kids were in the govt. system receiving some type of aid. And any type of problems with behavior at any schools would certainly flag them. There was a judge in PA who ended up in jail for supplying poor White kids and minorities to the juvenile jails. I'm disgusted.
 

Evolving78

Well-Known Member
[QUOTE="Evolving78, post: 25323437, member: 2496] And I see an office come to the school and pull up children’s registration records and pull children out of class all of the time.

Did they return to class? I'm also wondering if those kids were in the govt. system receiving some type of aid. And any type of problems with behavior at any schools would certainly flag them. There was a judge in PA who ended up in jail for supplying poor White kids and minorities to the juvenile jails. I'm disgusted.[/QUOTE]
Yes, and yes. But you are on to something.
 

Evolving78

Well-Known Member
I don’t know how people manage to teach/work in schools now. I feel like too much is being demanded of teachers. You’re supposed to accept being hit by students who are often larger than you. From what I’ve heard from teachers, you’re supposed to pass students who have never done their homework.
What is the solution?
It’s a funding issue. It all comes down to funding. If the child test well and shows the ability to do the work, as long as there are not failing 5 or more of the common core classes, the school passes them. Holding a child back for homework isn’t a big enough reason these days.
 

prettyinpurple

Well-Known Member
It is an elementary school so no psychologists, no dean, no counselor, and no social worker.
My kids had none of those things at their high performing highly rated elementary school.
No it's not.
Your kids' school doesn't have a counselor? Even a part-time one? That seems outrageous.

Little kids throw tantrums. It can't be the first that someone who works at an elementary school has seen a kid throw a fit or have a meltdown. I'd be surprised if teachers weren't given any instructions on how to deal with students in that state (or in general with kids of any age). I can imagine that the training could be lackluster due to funding though.

I wonder if elementary education majors discuss this in their classes? I assume people in Pre-K education classes must get that info since small kids can't verbalize their feelings well.

Also not true about staff being trained to properly restrain kids.
At my kids school a black and white kid both had tantrums and tore the class room up. Principal tried to restrain the black kid and was kicked. Black kid was expelled. New rule implemented that staff can't touch the kids. White kid tears class room up the next year and no one touched him. Everyone exited the room and he pulled down a book shelf. He got to stay because he had an IEP.
I don't think this means that staff weren't trained on how to restrain kids though, just means that the kid got a kick in which is not surprising.

I hope the black kid's family fought the school district over that suspension.
 

dicapr

Well-Known Member
Your kids' school doesn't have a counselor? Even a part-time one? That seems outrageous.

Little kids throw tantrums. It can't be the first that someone who works at an elementary school has seen a kid throw a fit or have a meltdown. I'd be surprised if teachers weren't given any instructions on how to deal with students in that state (or in general with kids of any age). I can imagine that the training could be lackluster due to funding though.

I wonder if elementary education majors discuss this in their classes? I assume people in Pre-K education classes must get that info since small kids can't verbalize their feelings well.


I don't think this means that staff weren't trained on how to restrain kids though, just means that the kid got a kick in which is not surprising.

I hope the black kid's family fought the school district over that suspension.


Little kids throw tantrums but most have outgrown that behavior by the time they get to school. A 6 year old throwing a temper tantrum to the point of hitting and kicking usually has some underlying issues like this little girl. So no it isn’t normal for a 6 year old to be hitting and kicking.
 

prettyinpurple

Well-Known Member
Little kids throw tantrums but most have outgrown that behavior by the time they get to school. A 6 year old throwing a temper tantrum to the point of hitting and kicking usually has some underlying issues like this little girl. So no it isn’t normal for a 6 year old to be hitting and kicking.
I know that every kid doesn't do it, but it certainly isn't rare. I've seen plenty of kids that age having tantrums in public lol. Elementary school staff should be prepared for a young kid having a meltdown or tantrum.
 

Alta Angel

Well-Known Member
This. An autistic student with an IEP flew into a rage a knocked over a bookshelf in my room. I calmly escorted the students out of the room and had an administrator called. Fortunately he didn't completely tear the room up. I am not about to restrain a 14 year old boy that is completely agitated.

Also not true about staff being trained to properly restrain kids.
At my kids school a black and white kid both had tantrums and tore the class room up. Principal tried to restrain the black kid and was kicked. Black kid was expelled. New rule implemented that staff can't touch the kids. White kid tears class room up the next year and no one touched him. Everyone exited the room and he pulled down a book shelf. He got to stay because he had an IEP.
 

LavenderMint

Well-Known Member
It is an elementary school so no psychologists, no dean, no counselor, and no social worker.
My kids had none of those things at their high performing highly rated elementary school.



No it's not.
Basically every school district is different and even within the districts, every school is different. And charter schools are a whole different animal altogether. (The antics of our local charters have soured them for me in a BIG way)

My PK-5 school has a school psychologist (misnomer because most of what they do is testing & interpreting tests), a social worker, a mental health clinician, & a partnership with a free mental health program that provides counseling and wrap-around services (home & school mental health counseling). We have a nurse but she is for medical emergencies.

When I had a pk kid who threw massive tantrums (last year & 2years before), of the chair throwing & I’m going to punch you lady- sort, I INSISTED on solutions being made for the safety of myself and the other students. I am NOT trained to restrain or deescalate a child who has reached that point of crisis. We are not that kind of school (it would be considered a more restrictive environment). So I trained my kids that when he reached for that first chair, I said the cue & my class would evacuate the room. It was easier than trying to deal with him. My philosophy was “this is above my pay grade” and I texted all the above mentioned people to deal with him.
But we also knew this was a very young child dealing with trauma & treated him as such.

With children that young, getting IEPs or 504s are almost impossible unless they were previously identified by their daycare (like Head Start), identified by pediatrician, or born with a diagnosable condition. In the 11 years I’ve been teaching, I have yet to see a child I KNEW and documented a need for an IEP get one before 1st grade.

My initial thought when I saw it was a charter was to wonder just how interested they were in actually helping this child to begin with. The charters in my area will typically enroll anyone they can get- even when warned by parents that their child is “tough”, keep them long enough to secure the state funds and then boot them at the slightest infraction because they can. Then the public schools see an influx of “problem” children in October-November because the count occurs at the end of September in my district and those funds do not follow the child.
 

dicapr

Well-Known Member
I know that every kid doesn't do it, but it certainly isn't rare. I've seen plenty of kids that age having tantrums in public lol. Elementary school staff should be prepared for a young kid having a meltdown or tantrum.

It might not be rare but it is not developmentally appropriate. Either the parents never corrected the behavior or there is something else going on with the child. It’s not normal developmental behavior for that age group. If a six year old is still having meltdowns and tantrums it is cause for concern or the parents need to seek new strategies for controlling that behavior.
 

quirkydimples

Well-Known Member
In real life parents don't answer the phone because they know you are calling about their bad behaving child.
This. I’m at a HS campus, but we have an elementary AP walking around with a serious bite mark on her leg (among other injuries) because of a kindergartner whose parents refuse to have the child evaluated.

At the HS level, at a certain point the kid is going to be arrested because they’re putting other people’s safety at risk. At the elementary school
level, it’s much trickier, but can usually be controlled because of their size.

At the HS level, I have dealt with many parents who just stop answering my calls because they don’t want to deal with their kid’s behavior.
 

prettyinpurple

Well-Known Member
It might not be rare but it is not developmentally appropriate. Either the parents never corrected the behavior or there is something else going on with the child. It’s not normal developmental behavior for that age group. If a six year old is still having meltdowns and tantrums it is cause for concern or the parents need to seek new strategies for controlling that behavior.
We can agree to disagree. Either way, it's not so rare as to be unexpected in an elementary school environment.

A 6 year old can still get worked up and be unable to express her feelings verbally in a meaningful way, which can lead to a tantrum or meltdown especially if there's an underlying medical condition. I know the after school meltdown is a real thing with early elementary age kids. Or a meltdown when they're tired, or had a long day with lots of activity. I don't think a tantrum or two is cause for concern.

From the American Academy of Pediatrics: https://www.healthychildren.org/Eng...ication-discipline/Pages/Temper-Tantrums.aspx
"Choose your battles and accommodate when you can. Sometimes you have to give in a little to settle yourself; that’s OK. However, your consistency from day to day is key in reducing the level and frequency of tantrums. So is time. Although most tantrums happen in 1- to 3-year-old children, many children continue to throw tantrums into the school years."

That link also mentions a zero tolerance policy for hitting, kicking, etc.

Whew it's hard being a parent. Once my friends started having kids and I started hanging out with the kids more, I had more sympathy for the times when kids have tantrums and meltdowns. Sometimes you just gonna let it run its course (if there's no danger to the child or anyone of course). I definitely don't judge strangers when I see it in public.

This. I’m at a HS campus, but we have an elementary AP walking around with a serious bite mark on her leg (among other injuries) because of a kindergartner whose parents refuse to have the child evaluated.

At the HS level, at a certain point the kid is going to be arrested because they’re putting other people’s safety at risk. At the elementary school
level, it’s much trickier, but can usually be controlled because of their size.

At the HS level, I have dealt with many parents who just stop answering my calls because they don’t want to deal with their kid’s behavior.
I can't imagine working in a high school when kids get violent. I'd just call security and get out of the way.
 

dicapr

Well-Known Member
We can agree to disagree. Either way, it's not so rare as to be unexpected in an elementary school environment.

A 6 year old can still get worked up and be unable to express her feelings verbally in a meaningful way, which can lead to a tantrum or meltdown especially if there's an underlying medical condition. I know the after school meltdown is a real thing with early elementary age kids. Or a meltdown when they're tired, or had a long day with lots of activity. I don't think a tantrum or two is cause for concern.

From the American Academy of Pediatrics: https://www.healthychildren.org/Eng...ication-discipline/Pages/Temper-Tantrums.aspx
"Choose your battles and accommodate when you can. Sometimes you have to give in a little to settle yourself; that’s OK. However, your consistency from day to day is key in reducing the level and frequency of tantrums. So is time. Although most tantrums happen in 1- to 3-year-old children, many children continue to throw tantrums into the school years."

That link also mentions a zero tolerance policy for hitting, kicking, etc.

Whew it's hard being a parent. Once my friends started having kids and I started hanging out with the kids more, I had more sympathy for the times when kids have tantrums and meltdowns. Sometimes you just gonna let it run its course (if there's no danger to the child or anyone of course). I definitely don't judge strangers when I see it in public.


I can't imagine working in a high school when kids get violent. I'd just call security and get out of the way.


Yes we can agree to disagree. A 6 year old without underlying issues should not be kicking and hitting. Yes they get frustrated and cry ect but hitting kicking biting isn’t ok. Most kids get kicked out of preschool after the toddler room for that behavior.


This desire for control often shows up as saying "no" often and having tantrums. Tantrums are worsened by the fact that the child may not have the vocabulary to express his or her feelings. Tantrumsusually begin in children 12 to 18 months old. They get worse between age 2 to 3, then decrease until age 4.May 17, 2019
MedlinePlus (.gov) › ency › article
Temper
 

prettyinpurple

Well-Known Member
Yes we can agree to disagree. A 6 year old without underlying issues should not be kicking and hitting. Yes they get frustrated and cry ect but hitting kicking biting isn’t ok. Most kids get kicked out of preschool after the toddler room for that behavior.


This desire for control often shows up as saying "no" often and having tantrums. Tantrums are worsened by the fact that the child may not have the vocabulary to express his or her feelings. Tantrumsusually begin in children 12 to 18 months old. They get worse between age 2 to 3, then decrease until age 4.May 17, 2019
MedlinePlus (.gov) › ency › article
Temper
Yes I'm familiar with this article and yes you forgot the rest of the paragraph that says "After age 4, they rarely occur. Being tired, hungry, or sick, can make tantrums worse or more frequent" lol. My point is that it can occur in elementary school and it is not something that should surprise staff. I'd be surprised if a kindergarten or first grade teacher went an entire year without seeing a kid have a meltdown or tantrum. Yes, frequent tantrums and violent ones do need to be addressed by parents and the appropriate doctors, therapists, psychologists, counselors, etc.

In an ideal world, staff would have the appropriate training and backup help for these situations. It's sad when they do not have it.

Suspending kids from pre-school is a whole 'nother issue that bothers me and disproportionately affects black kids.
 

Reinventing21

Spreading my wings
I am not sure how you interpreted my meaning of staff, but to clarify I did not mean ALL staff. I mean that there are staff members in the building who have been formally trained for these situations. It is usually just a couple or handful of people that get the training as it is done by way of volunteers.

This was encouraged to avoid legal issues with adults trying to control.students. You are right that teachers and other staff are told not to engage in restraining or physically controlling students. Only certified staff with proper training are allowed to avoid improper handling of children as well as to protect staff from injuries as well.

Regarding your school, it is frustrating and messed up that kids with chronic violent behaviors are permitted to remain in the class due to an IEP. That sends the wrong message as everyone knows that the law in the real world will not care about IEPs.

It is a lose-lose situation if no one in the building is trained. If the child hurts himself in a room by himself, there is a problem and the child obviously should not be around other children either.

Also not true about staff being trained to properly restrain kids.
At my kids school a black and white kid both had tantrums and tore the class room up. Principal tried to restrain the black kid and was kicked. Black kid was expelled. New rule implemented that staff can't touch the kids. White kid tears class room up the next year and no one touched him. Everyone exited the room and he pulled down a book shelf. He got to stay because he had an IEP.
 

LivingInPeace

Well-Known Member
In a word... yes... also, back-in-the-day... We just called those monsters bad and beat them!
I didn’t want to say it but it’s true. You could cut up if you wanted to. But it would be dealt with swiftly. Ain’t nobody care if you had a “condition “. Then your parents would be advised and they would be invited to help “adjust “ your attitude as well.
 
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