Halp! Discourgaged, Natural 11 Years...

[blazingbeauty]

... and little to show for it. I have patches of hair (50%) that have reached anywhere from 14-16 inches long. The other 50% is only 11-12 inches (I shouldn’t say only because I’m grateful for what God has given me). I hate wearing my hair out though because the ends have been thin for years now, and my hair is all over the place length-wise. My Regimen is on my about page. Please HAALLP. Long Post Ahead.
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It’s the end of the year and I’ve finally decided to stop lurking and ask for help. I went natural all the way back in middle school, and I still love my natural hair, and all things black hair care. I am just discouraged that I have yet to reach any of my length goals, discouraged in part because I wanted to help prove to the naysayers that our hair is beautiful.

Not gonna lie, my hair has been THROUGH IT. I’ve gotten heat damage before, I’ve accidentally boiled my hair when sealing the ends of my Senegalese twists, not trimming for a year and a half thinned my ends completely, contact dermatitis from Tresemme conditioners set off a domino effect of most conditioners irritating/chemically burning my sensitive skin. Still, all of these incidents shouldn’t have held me back the way they have, because each occurred 3-4 years apart.

The majority of the time I only wore protective styles without extensions (twists in a bun or mini twists), I finger detangled ONLY, wore a satin bonnet every night faithfully. I would M&S a few times a week (everyday would cause breakage, my hair likes to be left alone in all things), washed my hair every 2 weeks (again once a week was too much manipulation and too much time). Moisturized with heavy/rich leave ins (Rinse Out Conditioners that are formulated to be left in like Shea Moisture’s Raw Shea Butter Co. Tangent - I used to use Tresemme as my Leave In - see the Tightly Curly Method - and loved it but the MI/MIT preservatives sensitized my skin terribly - so don’t come for me for using Shea Moisture ) and creams (my hair loves the LCG Method), sealed with grease or shea butter. I still do a majority of these things (including keeping my hair journal), because I don’t have breakage and my hair is the most moisturized it’s ever been.

Right now, I’ve decided to just enjoy my hair in a new Protective Style Challenge, one in which I push my skills and learn new styles that actually make me feel beautiful - just to reinvigorate my hair journey. I just trimmed off another two inches for a total of 4 inches trimmed this year. My hair grows a centimeter a month.

Please help me troubleshoot my routine.

 

[FadingDelilah]

1) Are the shorter patches in certain areas of your head, while the longer parts are in others? Or is it all mixed up?
2) Have you gotten bloodwork?
3) Do you lose a lot of hair finger detangling or would you say your shedding/breakage seems very minimal?
4) Do you think all the hair from your last setback (for all of the other setbacks, all of the damaged hair would be gone by now I think) has been trimmed away or could there still be some left?
5) Have you considered getting a hair analysis?

And also, welcome to the forum!!!!!

 

[michelle81]

How often do you trim and how much each time?

4 inches in a year seems like a lot to me but I'm very anti-trims. That's 10 cm and if you grow 12 cm a year then that's nearly all your year's progress.

 

[Sarabellam]

First if the shorter hairs are in a group you should figure out what likely cause the damage. Protective styles with added hair, heat damage, incorrect comb techniques, and styles that lead to matting are common offenders.

Cutting all your hair to 10-12 inches and babying your ends like you’ve recently been doing would probably give you the best results quickly.

I’m also a rare trimmer and currently growing out damage. I’ve had a similar cycle though my damage has been mainly due to heat from wrongly trusting stylists.

You can keep your hair healthy enough to grow longer with minimal trims but if you want a thick, crisp hemline as a minimal trimmer you have to grow past your hair goal then cut. The freshly cut hair will grow more quickly. If you are consistent with babying your hair it will be 3-4 inches longer with ok ends within a year.

A bonus is that 10-12 inches gives enough length to do most natural styles (buns, twists, out styles) for all textures. The crisp ends will also give your natural styles new life and improve detangling. Try to avoid cutting corners or using damaging styles when your hair is “behaving better” and you’ll be pleasantly surprised how quickly the first inch or two is gained.

 

[DMJ's Mom]

Hi! It may be your styling choices. So I’ve Been natural for almost 12 years and I started noticing a few years ago I was getting breakage and mid strand splits. My regimen hasn’t really changed in forever but in 2015 I’d begun wearing 2 strand twists in a bun. I was doing wet twists and that’s the only thing I can think of that was causing it. Sure enough, in March I cut off 8 inches of hair, stopped doing twists and I’ve noticed improvements on my length retention.

 

[Crackers Phinn]

I'm a big advocate of the key to length being more about how much of your hair you retain as opposed to how fast it grows. Try dipping your hair band in oil or conditioner so that the friction doesn't cause the hair underneath to become brittle when you wear your hair in a bun. Also try applying oil or leave in to the ends of your hair. If you can find a way to incorporate the baggy method into your routine then that might be helpful.

Trust me I get it that it's a struggle to find ways to balance feeling pretty with protective styling.

Good luck!

 

[Chicoro]

@DMJ's Mom avatar: Gorgeous hair!!!

@Crackers Phinn signature Menorah bong gif :


Regarding the post and solutions, I'm with Crackers on this one. It's what you retain and keep that make the difference. That is what you can control: how much hair you keep. Growth rate/speed/fastness is genetically programmed. You can optimize growth rate, but the most [hair] dividends are earned and paid when the focus and successes are related to retention.

 

[Alma Petra]

I'd also look into your moisture protein balance. Too little or too much of any of the two can make the hair more fragile. Personally my hair tends to snap in my hands when it's dry and in need of moisture or when it has too much protein. I can hear the strand snapping and I can then see the short piece on my fingers when I am finger detangling or styling (raking, shingling) when my hair is too dry or has had an encounter with too much protein.
When do you notice the breakage? If during detangling or styling, I'd suggest doing these in smaller sections, taking things more slowly to avoid ripping through your hair, focus on your mind muscle connection to be able to sense when a strand is going to snap and stop before it does so, soaking your hair in water completely (I scrunch water in repeatedly) before adding product for cowashing and finger detangling, using detangling and styling products that have more slip and allow the fingers to glide in more easily, and washing more frequently to avoid the build up of shed hairs that promotes knots and breakage. Also washing more frequently decreases the chances of hair drying out before the next round of manipulation (ie washing and detangling)
Other things that promote moisture: avoiding too much protein, oil rinsing, more frequent DC use?, and choosing the leave-in and LOC products that suit your hair and provide it with the best levels of moisture.

I hope you discover the issue soon.

 

[FoxxyLocs]

4 inches is a lot of trimming. I usually trim an inch per year unless I have a set back.

For me, the key is protecting my ends and making sure they don't tangle.

 

[blazingbeauty]

Hi FadingDelilah! Thanks for the welcome. To answer you Qs
1. The shorter patches are in the front and crown, the longer patches are in the sides and middle/back, so i’ve got a mullet at the moment.
2. I got my iron checked, and my levels were fine. I have lost a patch of hair in the past from a stressful situation, but once I found equilibrium, that section grew “fast” (or the so called average growth a month) weirdly enough.
3. Finger Detangling is Bae. It completely changed my hair game, and is one of the reasons why I even have longer patches at all . I broke my 3 year finger detangling stint and started to use my Seamless Wide Tooth, but it’s so much more gentle now bc I finger detangle snags it hits (NappyHeadedJojoba has a good video on the “method”)
4. The sides and back of my hair are fine for the most part, the front and crown are the areas that want to remain damaged. Legit, the front looks like I’m transitioning. The crown, is a little bit better.
5. Too broke, but also, my hair is the healthiest it’s been since my last setback, it’s been a lot easier to manage, it holds moisture well, and I can manipulate it dry (to a degree) to take down a bun etc, without breakage. And bc I know my staple products, I don’t stress wash day anymore. After boiling my ends a few years ago, I was strongly considering it.

1) Are the shorter patches in certain areas of your head, while the longer parts are in others? Or is it all mixed up?
2) Have you gotten bloodwork?
3) Do you lose a lot of hair finger detangling or would you say your shedding/breakage seems very minimal?
4) Do you think all the hair from your last setback (for all of the other setbacks, all of the damaged hair would be gone by now I think) has been trimmed away or could there still be some left?
5) Have you considered getting a hair analysis?

And also, welcome to the forum!!!!!

 

[blazingbeauty]

Sorry for the novel y’all!

@Crackers Phinn , @Chicoro - Thanks for responding! Never thought about oiling my hair bands - great idea.
I only bring up my growth rate (which I decided to finally measure a few months ago), because while I have noticed retention in the past (especially in the longer sections), I could not understand why I would “only” retain around 2 inches a year. I said to myself, “I only trim an inch twice a year? Shouldn’t I be retaining 4?” I wanted to figure out how to optimize my full growth potential, not knowing/realizing at the time my hair grows slower than the average. My goal length was HL at the time, now it’s MBL (I’m 5’9 so 14-15 inches on me feels like APL).

@Sarabellam @FoxxyLocs - Teach me your ways!! All I do is protective style (with no added hair). Lol, I have always hated trimming my hair, especially after reading this Nonie post a long time ago: https://longhaircareforum.com/threa...ear-without-trimming-please-take-part.529819/
I remembered it again a few years ago, and decided I would not trim for a year - continued to wear twists in a low bun (wore my hair out once that entire year - i don’t mind showcasing my face haha) sealed with grease instead of shea butter (which was fine bc I mixed Vaseline in my Shea mixtures to make them Smooth anyway - being in college with no electric whisk so I got creative). Plus I read too many Ktani posts about the benefits of mineral oil, how protective grease is, and that it’s only semi - impermeable. But my ends thinned to a point I’d never seen before. I’m still recovering from that. I’ll always love me some grease tho - that was never my problem.

@DMJ's Mom I’m starting to think my problem may be wearing twists in a low bun. I stopped wearing mini twists bc they caused more harm than good. I think the shorter sections in my crown and the front must get caught in the hair band or something. A little sad bc it’s such a cute and simple style. I stopped wearing Box braids and Senegalese twists a few years ago when I realized kanekalon wears down my hair strands. Now this? Oh well, I think the personal protective style challenge I’m on will resolve this. Each month I have to learn/ try one new simple and gentle protective style that is actually flattering. We shall see...

 

[FoxxyLocs]

When I bun, I don't put my hair in a ponytail first. I just wrap the hair around itself and pin in place (like a large Bantu knot). This keeps it from being too tight, and from getting snagged on a hair tie.

Also, I either keep my ends stretched (pressed, blow dried, or if braided/twisted I set the ends with perm rods so they don't tangle), or I use gel when I do a wash and go to keep my ends from tangling.

You really have to pay attention to how you do your protective styles. I remember I did a hide your hair challenge for a year and I ended up having to cut like 3 or 4 inches afterwards because my buns were allowing my ends to tangle so they weren't really protected. Just putting your hair away is not always enough, and it can do more harm than good if you aren't careful.

I've found that keeping my ends stretched is more important than keeping them from rubbing against my clothes or whatever.

ETA: I also prefer low manipulation over protective styling. I style my hair once every 1-2 weeks and don't do anything to it in between. Mostly twist outs, braid outs, wash and go's, etc. But I wear my hair down a lot. As long as my ends are stretched, and I'm not re-styling too often, I don't have any problems with length retention.

 

[DMJ's Mom]

Sorry for the novel y’all!

@Crackers Phinn , @Chicoro - Thanks for responding! Never thought about oiling my hair bands - great idea.
I only bring up my growth rate (which I decided to finally measure a few months ago), because while I have noticed retention in the past (especially in the longer sections), I could not understand why I would “only” retain around 2 inches a year. I said to myself, “I only trim an inch twice a year? Shouldn’t I be retaining 4?” I wanted to figure out how to optimize my full growth potential, not knowing/realizing at the time my hair grows slower than the average. My goal length was HL at the time, now it’s MBL (I’m 5’9 so 14-15 inches on me feels like APL).

@Sarabellam @FoxxyLocs - Teach me your ways!! All I do is protective style (with no added hair). Lol, I have always hated trimming my hair, especially after reading this Nonie post a long time ago: https://longhaircareforum.com/threa...ear-without-trimming-please-take-part.529819/
I remembered it again a few years ago, and decided I would not trim for a year - continued to wear twists in a low bun (wore my hair out once that entire year - i don’t mind showcasing my face haha) sealed with grease instead of shea butter (which was fine bc I mixed Vaseline in my Shea mixtures to make them Smooth anyway - being in college with no electric whisk so I got creative). Plus I read too many Ktani posts about the benefits of mineral oil, how protective grease is, and that it’s only semi - impermeable. But my ends thinned to a point I’d never seen before. I’m still recovering from that. I’ll always love me some grease tho - that was never my problem.

@DMJ's Mom I’m starting to think my problem may be wearing twists in a low bun. I stopped wearing mini twists bc they caused more harm than good. I think the shorter sections in my crown and the front must get caught in the hair band or something. A little sad bc it’s such a cute and simple style. I stopped wearing Box braids and Senegalese twists a few years ago when I realized kanekalon wears down my hair strands. Now this? Oh well, I think the personal protective style challenge I’m on will resolve this. Each month I have to learn/ try one new simple and gentle protective style that is actually flattering. We shall see...

Oh yeah! to go along with crackers phone mentioned I started wearing satin scrunchies. I started doing two flat twists into a bun and with a side part it’s pretty cute

 

[FadingDelilah]

Hmmmm.... so iron is normal, your products are working and finger detangling isnt the issue. How much damage (uneven ends) is left over right now? It would be helpful to have a timeline of your setbacks. Perhaps somehow the the choppiness occurred and managed to persist from your most recent one???? Especially if it wasn't that long ago. Hmmmm.... Yeah, I need a timeline. LOL.

If it was from styling habits, wouldn't you have noticed breakage or shedding? But you seem surprised by this. That's why I think that it must be either something from the past. Also, it sounds very uniform (not mixed very much), which is helpful to know.

Regardless, I think that once you continue taking care of your hair like you are and trimming regularly (as you see necessary for your hair), your hair will be fine. Also, I know this sounds stupid, but could it be that your hair grows at different speeds and you just somehow noticed? Lol. (<<< me reaching )

 

[Sarabellam]

Sorry for the novel y’all!

@Crackers Phinn , @Chicoro - Thanks for responding! Never thought about oiling my hair bands - great idea.
I only bring up my growth rate (which I decided to finally measure a few months ago), because while I have noticed retention in the past (especially in the longer sections), I could not understand why I would “only” retain around 2 inches a year. I said to myself, “I only trim an inch twice a year? Shouldn’t I be retaining 4?” I wanted to figure out how to optimize my full growth potential, not knowing/realizing at the time my hair grows slower than the average. My goal length was HL at the time, now it’s MBL (I’m 5’9 so 14-15 inches on me feels like APL).

@Sarabellam @FoxxyLocs - Teach me your ways!! All I do is protective style (with no added hair). Lol, I have always hated trimming my hair, especially after reading this Nonie post a long time ago: https://longhaircareforum.com/threa...ear-without-trimming-please-take-part.529819/
I remembered it again a few years ago, and decided I would not trim for a year - continued to wear twists in a low bun (wore my hair out once that entire year - i don’t mind showcasing my face haha) sealed with grease instead of shea butter (which was fine bc I mixed Vaseline in my Shea mixtures to make them Smooth anyway - being in college with no electric whisk so I got creative). Plus I read too many Ktani posts about the benefits of mineral oil, how protective grease is, and that it’s only semi - impermeable. But my ends thinned to a point I’d never seen before. I’m still recovering from that. I’ll always love me some grease tho - that was never my problem.

@DMJ's Mom I’m starting to think my problem may be wearing twists in a low bun. I stopped wearing mini twists bc they caused more harm than good. I think the shorter sections in my crown and the front must get caught in the hair band or something. A little sad bc it’s such a cute and simple style. I stopped wearing Box braids and Senegalese twists a few years ago when I realized kanekalon wears down my hair strands. Now this? Oh well, I think the personal protective style challenge I’m on will resolve this. Each month I have to learn/ try one new simple and gentle protective style that is actually flattering. We shall see...

Is your front and crown a different texture than the rest of your hair? This area is also where we put more emphasis on looking “perfect”. Are you more aggressive with styling in this area such as increased manipulation or pulling to smooth the hair? Over time this can lead to damage.

 

[blazingbeauty]

@Alma Petra - I think you are absolutely right! I’ve been lazy with my protein treatments this year. I started to get used to my hair being slightly over-moisturized I think. I’m going back to doing my Aphogee Treatments Every 8 Weeks (it worked great at that interval vs 3-4x a year)

@FadingDelilah - I’ve got to be honest, if my hair is all over the place like this, I must be experiencing breakage - most likely my pride at being natural so long is blinding me to it. On that note, here’s my timeline - I didn’t realize the damaging events were so close together. Thank God for Hair Journals (and your accountability check). I must have some residual damage in the areas that won’t retain length. I thought I cut it all out though.

Timeline:
Most Recent Heat Damage (Cheap Blow Dryer - Low Heat got way too hot; no heat protectant) - 4 Years Ago - My Hair still curled up, just felt different and broke a bit more.
Henna Treatments to “Correct” Damage - 4 Years Ago
Realized (my regimen for) Mini Twists & Kanekalon Damaged My Hair - 3 Years Ago
Rough Detangling Session -3 Years Ago
The Great Boiling of 2016 so 2 Years Ago
No Trim Challenge - 2017-2018 (1st half of year) - Started Trimming in April

@Sarabellam - How are you able to retain length while transitioning out damage instead of just chopping?
The front of my hair has a silkier texture, with more 3c curls that are s shaped. The crown/canapy of my hair is more of an s curl as well, but is more crunchy and frizzy - I think because the sun hits that area the most (UV damage?) the rest of my hair is pen coiled so 4b with frizz. I’m starting to suspect that the amount of “frizz” I have though is actually breakage. I never realized because I was seeing retention. Hmm...

@DMJ's Mom - How have I never thought about satin scrunchies??? They may allow me to continue to wear low twists buns (at least sometimes) without damage to my shorter front & crown sections! Do you see any hair in the scrunchy after you take down your styles?

 

[FadingDelilah]

Wow, I feel like we're getting somewhere but I'm still not sure why the front would break so much compared to the back. It could be the different textures, but it could not be. It sounds like different growth rates, tbh. My sister had hair that would grow evenly when she was younger. But now, the crown grows fast, while the nape grows slower, so her hair is pyramid shaped. How are you sure that this is not something similar? When you were measuring your growth rate, were you measuring just one area as a reference, or were you measuring several different spots each time? Btw, my hair grows 1 cm a month too. I feel your pain, lol.

 

[TamaraShaniece]

@FadingDelilah hmmmm... I experienced breakage just in the front from tight ponytails, buns, banana clips, etc. before.

FadingD I feel like is onto something. The way I wear low ponytails now is using a gentle hair tie or string to the back of my head. The front part, I’ll flat twist, etc and pin to the back to avoid tension.

Brushing your hair straight back while wet could be causing breakage to your front/ top layer, especially if your hair is already weakened. Boar bristle brushes, detangling brushes, etc are great a creating sleek styles but can also cause the greatest damage. They can cause our hair to stretch beyond it’s healthy limits. (Too much moisture can cause breakage, since ur elasticity is high)

How are you styling your hair on wash day? In the morning? Before bed?

Did you recently take your hair out of a protective style and was shocked by the length difference? If your hair was damaged, dried out, etc or was mechanically damaged prior to PS, then you’ll have to wait for the damage to grow up.

With your back and sides being long, it just sounds like, the front part of your hair received the most tension, stretched passed normal elasticity, moisture overload, and is breaking off at the same spot (hence the mohawk look).

 

[Sarabellam]

@Alma Petra - I think you are absolutely right! I’ve been lazy with my protein treatments this year. I started to get used to my hair being slightly over-moisturized I think. I’m going back to doing my Aphogee Treatments Every 8 Weeks (it worked great at that interval vs 3-4x a year)

@FadingDelilah - I’ve got to be honest, if my hair is all over the place like this, I must be experiencing breakage - most likely my pride at being natural so long is blinding me to it. On that note, here’s my timeline - I didn’t realize the damaging events were so close together. Thank God for Hair Journals (and your accountability check). I must have some residual damage in the areas that won’t retain length. I thought I cut it all out though.

Timeline:
Most Recent Heat Damage (Cheap Blow Dryer - Low Heat got way too hot; no heat protectant) - 4 Years Ago - My Hair still curled up, just felt different and broke a bit more.
Henna Treatments to “Correct” Damage - 4 Years Ago
Realized (my regimen for) Mini Twists & Kanekalon Damaged My Hair - 3 Years Ago
Rough Detangling Session -3 Years Ago
The Great Boiling of 2016 so 2 Years Ago
No Trim Challenge - 2017-2018 (1st half of year) - Started Trimming in April

@Sarabellam - How are you able to retain length while transitioning out damage instead of just chopping?
The front of my hair has a silkier texture, with more 3c curls that are s shaped. The crown/canapy of my hair is more of an s curl as well, but is more crunchy and frizzy - I think because the sun hits that area the most (UV damage?) the rest of my hair is pen coiled so 4b with frizz. I’m starting to suspect that the amount of “frizz” I have though is actually breakage. I never realized because I was seeing retention. Hmm...

@DMJ's Mom - How have I never thought about satin scrunchies??? They may allow me to continue to wear low twists buns (at least sometimes) without damage to my shorter front & crown sections! Do you see any hair in the scrunchy after you take down your styles?

I hope this helps but based on what you’ve written I think that you hair is doing a bit better than you believe that it is. As you learn to avoid past sources of damage you’ll have fewer future causes of damage. The other ladies have given great ideas for what could be causing the damage.

2 years ago I had severe heat damage after just two sessions with a hair stylist leading up to a big event. My 4b/a hair was pin straight at the root in the front and various other areas.

I have fine hair that is easily broken even when healthy. I decided that since my entire head of hair was “ruined” I would use it as an opportunity to create a regimine that could make even my damaged hair retain length.

This was not for the sake of the damaged hair but for my healthy hair as it grows out and the damage is finally all cut off. I also know from past experience that my healthy hair “grows” in faster when the is ample damage hair to buffer the daily wear and tear. My previous trim schedule was 1-2x per year. I’ve gone over that now out of curiousity of what would happen. However, my healthy hair is still so far from my hemline it is still protected from my experiment.

My regimine is based on avoiding heat, minimizing mechanical damage, and fortifying my hair with a combination of hard protein (aphogee 2 step), and naturally based commercial and diy products. I also protect my ends by keeping them in protective styles and try to choose protective styles that also minimize tangles in between wash days. I finger detangle exclusively though I have wide tooth seamless combs that I will used when I reintroduce the occasional home blowout. When I finger detangle I change technique based on the hair texture, tangle severity, and my goal for that detangling session. Beyond technique the only products that are must haves for me right now are:

Aphogee 2 step (just the protein treatment)
Kinky curly knot today - ph balanced, great detangler, easily cleansed from hair
Henna- I use Nupur and fit it in where I can around my schedule (goal is every 2 months)
Shea butter- I make a mixture with castor and safflower oil
J.r. Liggets shampoo bar ( I love all of them except the original and peppermint)- it is both the most effective and gentlest shampoo that I have used but it is a true soap meaning is is slightly basic and hair should be covered in a ph balanced solution at some point following usage. I use the kckt for this.
Mud wash- done rarely when my hair needs some moisture balancing.

Products that I am really liking are
Camille rose blue algae conditioner (moisture)
mielle organics babassu oil conditioner (mild protein)
Pre-poo scalp treatment - castor oil and safflower oil mixed with eos

Products that I am trying out:
Rice water- usually not fermented. If fermented boil before using.
Adding eos to my water spray bottle for mid week moisture
X-cel used on and off

Other tips:
My life is so busy I can’t say that I follow any specific daily regimen long term. I tend towards trying to keep my hair moisturized and turn to either henna or protein once my hair is optimally moisturized but still doesn’t feel optimal.

I find that being gentle while styling, picking hair styles that optimize scalp and hair end health, avoiding ingredients that my hair doesn’t agree with (glycerin and alcohol), and sealing the ends with a natural oil are the base to any retention success that I have had since going natural over a decade ago. Everything else optimizes the process.

Also, I don’t wait for my hair retention to clue me in to my hair’s health. Whenever I interact with my hair I am mindful of evidence of broken strands. When I find a shed hair when my hair is in a dry state I wrap the strand around my index fingers and pull. I know from years of doing this that when my hair is in its most fortified state I feel a pinch in my fingers before the hair snaps. If that doesn’t happen I figure out what my hair needs during the next wash day to balance it.

 

[DMJ's Mom]

@Alma Petra - I think you are absolutely right! I’ve been lazy with my protein treatments this year. I started to get used to my hair being slightly over-moisturized I think. I’m going back to doing my Aphogee Treatments Every 8 Weeks (it worked great at that interval vs 3-4x a year)

@FadingDelilah - I’ve got to be honest, if my hair is all over the place like this, I must be experiencing breakage - most likely my pride at being natural so long is blinding me to it. On that note, here’s my timeline - I didn’t realize the damaging events were so close together. Thank God for Hair Journals (and your accountability check). I must have some residual damage in the areas that won’t retain length. I thought I cut it all out though.

Timeline:
Most Recent Heat Damage (Cheap Blow Dryer - Low Heat got way too hot; no heat protectant) - 4 Years Ago - My Hair still curled up, just felt different and broke a bit more.
Henna Treatments to “Correct” Damage - 4 Years Ago
Realized (my regimen for) Mini Twists & Kanekalon Damaged My Hair - 3 Years Ago
Rough Detangling Session -3 Years Ago
The Great Boiling of 2016 so 2 Years Ago
No Trim Challenge - 2017-2018 (1st half of year) - Started Trimming in April

@Sarabellam - How are you able to retain length while transitioning out damage instead of just chopping?
The front of my hair has a silkier texture, with more 3c curls that are s shaped. The crown/canapy of my hair is more of an s curl as well, but is more crunchy and frizzy - I think because the sun hits that area the most (UV damage?) the rest of my hair is pen coiled so 4b with frizz. I’m starting to suspect that the amount of “frizz” I have though is actually breakage. I never realized because I was seeing retention. Hmm...

@DMJ's Mom - How have I never thought about satin scrunchies??? They may allow me to continue to wear low twists buns (at least sometimes) without damage to my shorter front & crown sections! Do you see any hair in the scrunchy after you take down your styles?

No! None and I love them so much. It makes it hard to make the ponytail too tight

 

[blazingbeauty]

@FadingDelilah I think you are right. I’ve always suspected that the back and sides grew faster than the front. My current hair practices are probably sufficient to see rententjon in those areas but not in the front and crown. This may sound crazy, but I cleaned up my kitchen/nape and measured how fast that area grew back. It has varying growth rates so I chose the slowest area as a baseline.

@TamaraShaniece - I used to wear medium/small twists in a bun religiously. It was so easy to do.I’d bun them damp after M&S on wash day. Because the front is shorter, the ends of the front twists are always SUPER straight (worryingly so). I agree with your “diagnosis” of the problem at the end of your prev post. Oh, I just started using brushes in my hair about two month ago, and only soft ones on my wash day. I rely on my scarf to flatten my hair/add shine/neatness. I remember visiting my mom one day during a break and having to bob and weave to avoid the brush in her hand.

@Sarabellam - Thank you for the time to share your experience; I appreciate getting the chance to read it. I’m sorry your hair sustained such terrible damage. But it sounds like your hair is doing fabulously despite all that! Did you experience thinning/more breakage during your year without trimming? And if so, did it prevent length retention?What’s encouraging to me is that we have similar regimens. Right down to the Aphogee 2 Step Rx (different wash day products though). I don’t DC because I find my hair is still overmoisturized without it, and the residue can irritate my skin - Aphogee doesn’t though thank God.

The subject of mechanical damage jumped out. I’m starting to think that my regimen seems good on paper, but I’m allowing hidden sources of mechanical damage to stunt the growth of certain parts of my hair. For the first time in a long time a few weeks ago, I was frustrated my hair to the point where I started ripping through it with a comb (first time using a comb after 3 years) - that’s what led to this most recent trim. Not a hidden source of damage per se but damage that I swept under the rug or underestimated for a bit.

 

[blazingbeauty]

@Chicoro - sorry to bug, I just find your trimming philosophy very interesting. How often do you trim a year? Do you trim if you notice more broken pieces due to something like natural weathering? Finally, what constitutes damage (I guess using thinning as a sign) vs normal growth in your opinion? I don’t think my hair strands are necessarily fine, but they are normal to high porosity and on the fragile side.

 

[FadingDelilah]

Measure the growth rate in your crown for a few months. That might just be the missing piece. Good luck.

 

[Chicoro]

@Chicoro - sorry to bug, I just find your trimming philosophy very interesting. How often do you trim a year? Do you trim if you notice more broken pieces due to something like natural weathering? Finally, what constitutes damage (I guess using thinning as a sign) vs normal growth in your opinion? I don’t think my hair strands are necessarily fine, but they are normal to high porosity and on the fragile side.

You're not bugging me.

How often do you trim a year?
I trim my hair when I straighten it. I haven't had a real trim since around 2014. So, the last time I had a deep trim is going on five (5) years, in 2019.

I've done some snipping though. I may cut off a few hairs on a braid or two. I'm not trying to sound deliberately vague.I get the BEST and the deepest trims when I heat straighten my hair. With that stated, the last time I got my hair trimmed was in 2014 when I got it flat ironed. I don't trim my hair myself because when I do it, a 1/2 of an inch trim turns into 10 to 12 inches lost. That's not an exaggeration. I actually did that in 2012.

Do you trim if you notice more broken pieces due to something like natural weathering?

• No, I do not. I consider my hair to be breaking if I see a whole bunch of short little hairs, the same length, in my sink. That might be due to using too strong of a product or using a product that was too drying. I don't trim in that case because the hair is already broken off, what's the point in trimming more off? That is not me trying to be a smart mouth. That is my sincere perspective.

.

• If I have hair that is broken out or off in patches, trimming is not going to help it that either. That usually means to me that I have tension in that area. So, I stop the tension. Since the hair that is broken is significantly shorter than the rest of the hair, and that is the reason why I noticed the breakage, why should I trim it if it is already short? Again, not being smart mouthed.

• On "my" head, weathered hair does not show up until I heat straighten my hair. In that case, my weathered hair is dry, brittle and has a grayish, dull cast to it in contrast to the rest of my hair. That hair I trim. But as I mentioned early, I only do real trims when I get my hair heat straightened (blowdried, pressed/flatironed.)

Finally, what constitutes damage (I guess using thinning as a sign) vs normal growth in your opinion?

To me, the hair is growing if it drops to newer, longer lengths. I've rarely if ever have seen afro-textured hair drop all at the same length, at the same thickness. EVENTUALLY, if nurtured and protected, it thickens up at the newer length. But that takes time and patience. That newer, thinner hair doesn't style like thick, even strands. So, people judge it as not being healthy and they cut it and wonder why they are not gaining length. Many people say that that newer, longer hair is lacking or missing cuticle layers and that it is damaged. That is possible, but not likely the case.

If your hair STAYS at the same length, and the ends become thinner, then the hair is likely breaking, in my opinion.

The first photo, you can clearly see that the hair is trimmed and even. But , in the back, even against the white shirt, you can see that the ends are see through in some areas.

But I don't care because my goal is not to have thick, magazine perfect hair. I rarely wear my hair out in styles where the shape of my hair matters. I wear braids, buns and ponytails.

Also, that length in the photo was not my goal length. As long as the bulk of my hair is around the same length, and my ends are not gray and weathered, I keep on growing it.

Copying these ladies as they tend to have an interest in this subject.
@GGsKin
@caribeandiva
@Prettyeyes

 

[Alma Petra]

You're not bugging me.

How often do you trim a year?
I trim my hair when I straighten it. I haven't had a real trim since around 2014. So, the last time I had a deep trim is going on five (5) years, in 2019.

I've done some snipping though. I may cut off a few hairs on a braid or two. I'm not trying to sound deliberately vague.I get the BEST and the deepest trims when I heat straighten my hair. With that stated, the last time I got my hair trimmed was in 2014 when I got it flat ironed. I don't trim my hair myself because when I do it, a 1/2 of an inch trim turns into 10 to 12 inches lost. That's not an exaggeration. I actually did that in 2012.

Do you trim if you notice more broken pieces due to something like natural weathering?

• No, I do not. I consider my hair to be breaking if I see a whole bunch of short little hairs, the same length, in my sink. That might be due to using too strong of a product or using a product that was too drying. I don't trim in that case because the hair is already broken off, what's the point in trimming more off? That is not me trying to be a smart mouth. That is my sincere perspective.

.

• If I have hair that is broken out or off in patches, trimming is not going to help it that either. That usually means to me that I have tension in that area. So, I stop the tension. Since the hair that is broken is significantly shorter than the rest of the hair, and that is the reason why I noticed the breakage, why should I trim it if it is already short? Again, not being smart mouthed.

• On "my" head, weathered hair does not show up until I heat straighten my hair. In that case, my weathered hair is dry, brittle and has a grayish, dull cast to it in contrast to the rest of my hair. That hair I trim. But as I mentioned early, I only do real trims when I get my hair heat straightened (blowdried, pressed/flatironed.)

Finally, what constitutes damage (I guess using thinning as a sign) vs normal growth in your opinion?

To me, the hair is growing if it drops to newer, longer lengths. I've rarely if ever have seen afro-textured hair drop all at the same length, at the same thickness. EVENTUALLY, if nurtured and protected, it thickens up at the newer length. But that takes time and patience. That newer, thinner hair doesn't style like thick, even strands. So, people judge it as not being healthy and they cut it and wonder why they are not gaining length. Many people say that that newer, longer hair is lacking or missing cuticle layers and that it is damaged. That is possible, but not likely the case.

If your hair STAYS at the same length, and the ends become thinner, then the hair is likely breaking, in my opinion.

The first photo, you can clearly see that the hair is trimmed and even. But , in the back, even against the white shirt, you can see that the ends are see through in some areas.

But I don't care because my goal is not to have thick, magazine perfect hair. I rarely wear my hair out in styles where the shape of my hair matters. I wear braids, buns and ponytails.

Also, that length in the photo was not my goal length. As long as the bulk of my hair is around the same length, and my ends are not gray and weathered, I keep on growing it.

Copying these ladies as they tend to have an interest in this subject.
@GGsKin
@caribeandiva
@Prettyeyes

I love this post Chicoro! I find that I totally agree with your views on trimming. I will only trim if my ends become so damaged that they constantly tangle and cause me to lose a significant amount of hair. Otherwise if the tangling can be prevented with moisture, sealing and slippery products, and my ends curl up nicely (I wear wash and gos currently) then why should I trim? And btw sometimes I'm tempted to, because the front of my hair which I've been heavily experimenting on for over a year definitely has ends that feel rougher and dryer than the length but as you can see they curl without problems and don't usually cause tangles so I won't trim them. In fact they probably protect the length from damage.
View media item 129943
The people on LHC forums who grow their hair to unicorn lengths call these thinning out non-uniform ends "fairytale" ends, and they are considered to be perfectly normal when you reach long lengths and so many people prefer them to blunt ends. If you google fairlytale ends you'll see that they are popular.

For people who wear their hair curly, I'd advocate a dry curly cut to give the hair "shape". These invariably will translate to non-uniform ends when the hair is straightened. But if you wear your hair mainly curly then for me that's definitely the way to go. I'll try to get one of these once my hair grows longer.

 

[blazingbeauty]

@Chicoro @Alma Petra - both of your hair is so pretty! I’m happy to do away with the myth that ends have to be perfect for our hair to grow. I do like the feel of smooth ends, but that only lasts for so long anyway. Anyway, thank you so much for taking the time to offer advice! To everyone really. This community is so supportive!

I’m so tempted to go on another no trim challenge and just trim/dust at the end of the year. I’m thimking that if I alternate my protective styles, keep up with my aphogee treatments, start using satin scrunchies, and stick to my normal routine, I should see progress.

Also, Chicoro, what are your thoughts on grease vs shea butter (if you have had experience with both)? I know about the Shea challenge and I love both products (especially the price and simply of grease). I think of chebe and how protective it is when I think of grease (courtesy of a Youtube comment).

 

[Chicoro]

@Chicoro @Alma Petra - both of your hair is so pretty! I’m happy to do away with the myth that ends have to be perfect for our hair to grow. I do like the feel of smooth ends, but that only lasts for so long anyway. Anyway, thank you so much for taking the time to offer advice! To everyone really. This community is so supportive!

I’m so tempted to go on another no trim challenge and just trim/dust at the end of the year. I’m thimking that if I alternate my protective styles, keep up with my aphogee treatments, start using satin scrunchies, and stick to my normal routine, I should see progress.

Also, Chicoro, what are your thoughts on grease vs shea butter (if you have had experience with both)? I know about the Shea challenge and I love both products (especially the price and simply of grease). I think of chebe and how protective it is when I think of grease (courtesy of a Youtube comment).

Grease and Shea butter are not the same. One is an 'apple' the other is an 'orange'.