How I Learned That Being West Indian Didn't Make Me Better Than African Americans

FelaShrine

Well-Known Member
I am not to fond of how some black people from other countries are only black when it is convenient for them. I have a Nigerian friend who is a first generation american. She recently told me that she gets upset when people do not consider her Nigerian since she was born and raised in America and not Nigeria. I mean it really upsets her. She has told me that she does not consider herself African American. She states that she is Nigerian. After she told me this recently, I thought back to the times for instance when her and her sister were stating that black African American women have attitudes. My thing is, if they do not consider themselves African American, they need not talk about us in my presence again. Also, many (not all) Africans, Carribeans, Hatians, etc. will swear up and down that they are not black, but I bet when it comes to applying to grad school, many will check off african american in a heart beat for the affirmative action advantage.

You sound silly.
 

CaraWalker

Well-Known Member
No...AA means something very specific. I can move to Nigeria and that doesn't make me Nigerian ethnically or culturally. So why would moving to the US make someone AA?

i might agree with you if the distinction was black american vs african american but actually, i still dont. i think they all say literally exactly the same thing.

the only thing i think is different is when its not american ie african british african canadian. beyond that i honestly do not see the need to make a distinction unless one wants to be clear that they are not an american slave descendant.

****that doesnt mean that people dont have the right to make those distinctions of that i think they SHOULDNT. *IMA* just think its petty when they do.
 

Femmefatal1981

Well-Known Member
i might agree with you if the distinction was black american vs african american but actually, i still dont. i think they all say literally exactly the same thing.

the only thing i think is different is when its not american ie african british african canadian. beyond that i honestly do not see the need to make a distinction unless one wants to be clear that they are not an american slave descendant.

****that doesnt mean that people dont have the right to make those distinctions of that i think they SHOULDNT. *IMA* just think its petty when they do.
Black American = African American. Both words refer to the descendants of African slaves in America. The only difference between the terms is when black Americans connected more with their roots it transitioned to AA. Immigrants are *insert country of origin-American*

For example, you can be a Black South African-American or a White South African-American, but neither are African-Americans. My sociology professor in college preferred Black American because he thought "African" should be reserved for immigrants because of you are black obviously you are of African descent.
 

Menina Preta

Well-Known Member
Maybe they wonder why Haiti would be excluded? I know the longer this thread goes the more I wonder why every other island is WI but not Haiti.

I guess. But I don't think the term "West Indian" means that much to people who actually live in the West Indies. I feel like it's more so used by Caribbean people who migrate elsewhere as a term of solidarity with other islanders b/c they're so much fewer in number abroad and that's why abroad people just include Haitians when using that term. Also, I think West Indian used to refer to people who were primarily from former British colonies, but now it's kinda used to describe any one from the non-Spanish speaking Caribbean.
 

Menina Preta

Well-Known Member
i might agree with you if the distinction was black american vs african american but actually, i still dont. i think they all say literally exactly the same thing.

the only thing i think is different is when its not american ie african british african canadian. beyond that i honestly do not see the need to make a distinction unless one wants to be clear that they are not an american slave descendant.

****that doesnt mean that people dont have the right to make those distinctions of that i think they SHOULDNT. *IMA* just think its petty when they do.

I don't think someone is being petty depending on the way it is said and in what context. People are proud of their cultural backgrounds and I think it's fine if someone says "No, actually I am from XYZ place originally." What annoys me is when no one asked you where you are from or the topic doesn't come up in convo, but you feel the need to share right away…that's petty.
 

CaraWalker

Well-Known Member
Black American = African American. Both words refer to the descendants of African slaves in America. The only difference between the terms is when black Americans connected more with their roots it transitioned to AA. Immigrants are *insert country of origin-American*

For example, you can be a Black South African-American or a White South African-American, but neither are African-Americans. My sociology professor in college preferred Black American because he thought "African" should be reserved for immigrants because of you are black obviously you are of African descent.

i think black is black is black. im not gonna go around calling white americans french-american or swedish-american or german american either and we will all live with it.
 

ThirdEyeBeauty

Well-Known Member
I think this all depends on the person.
I know a second generation who calls himself African American although he is that and part of his parent's culture too. He identifies with it all and does not minimize his background at all but he knows he is black.
 

LeftRightRepeat

Well-Known Member
I did wonder why most (myself included ) think that W. Indies refers only to the British West Indies....and I think for one the British West Indies is the only group that has tried for any measure of cohesion (as opposed to Spanish, French, Danish West Indies). In 1952, the islands of the British West Indies formed the West Indies Federation and tried to unite their political power to lobby Britain. Also the West Indies Cricket team, which is a multi- island team, is composed of players from mainly English speaking Caribbean countries. The term ( "West Indian") also tends to be used more often in England where it refers to people from the former British colonies.



(ok i leaving this dying horse alone now )
 

Femmefatal1981

Well-Known Member
i think black is black is black. im not gonna go around calling white americans french-american or swedish-american or german american either and we will all live with it.
I'm not from any of those places so I don't care, but don't be shocked when you are corrected. Not every white person living here identifies as American. My German aunt would correct you. She identifies as German...and that's it. She's been here 35 + yrs and if you ask her what she is, she says German. Same goes for my French colleague, she identifies as French, but she hasn't been here very long. There is nothing wrong with immigrants of all races identifying themselves by country of origin. As long as that doesn't mean denying the connection they have with people of the same race who are living other places.
 

CaraWalker

Well-Known Member
I'm not from any of those places so I don't care, but don't be shocked when you are corrected. Not every white person living here identifies as American. My German aunt would correct you. She identifies as German...and that's it. She's been here 35 + yrs and if you ask her what she is, she says German. Same goes for my French colleague, she identifies as French, but she hasn't been here very long. There is nothing wrong with immigrants of all races identifying themselves by country of origin. As long as that doesn't mean denying the connection they have with people of the same race who are living other places.
this doesnt seem to be the case with white people. they will tell you their ethnicity, but it does not trump their nationality. the only time the country is primary is if they were born there. it seems to be only black people that want their nationality to take place over their ethnicity.
 

sj10460

Don't Come for me unless I send for you!
^^ I think for most 2nd and 3rd generation born or even 1st gens, being american is a given so there's no need to state one's nationality. I went to school with a few Italians and they will tell you in a heartbeat they are Italian (unsolicited of course) yet they've never been to Italy a day in their life.

Don't understand why there's an objection towards non-AA stating their ethnicity or heritage.
 

CaraWalker

Well-Known Member
i do think the exception is polish people because i dont know that ive ever met a polish person who didnt make it be known that theyre polish but im also not sure how many of them were actual immigrants. so yeah. i think this is a rare thing to do.

this conversation has helped me understand that i process people according to their nationality, not their country of origin, and i find that to be helpful information.
 

silverbuttons

Not Impressed
It's geographically incorrect to consider Haiti not part of the West Indies. Like... I don't understand why someone would be perplexed about fact. Just like it's fact that Haitians are Latinos. If you don't "think of them that way", thats... fine I guess. Just don't dispute fact.

Why are people so confused?
 

Menina Preta

Well-Known Member
It's geographically incorrect to consider Haiti not part of the West Indies. Like... I don't understand why someone would be perplexed about fact. Just like it's fact that Haitians are Latinos. If you don't "think of them that way", thats... fine I guess. Just don't dispute fact.

Why are people so confused?

So any Caribbean person is now Latino? Or are Haitians Latino bc they share Hispaniola with the DR? Also, no one is saying that Haiti is not in the West Indies. Cuba and Puerto Rico are in the West Indies, but people don't usually call them West Indian. And it was Haitians who came in here initially saying they're not West Indian.
 

LeftRightRepeat

Well-Known Member
^^ I think for most 2nd and 3rd generation born or even 1st gens, being american is a given so there's no need to state one's nationality. I went to school with a few Italians and they will tell you in a heartbeat they are Italian (unsolicited of course) yet they've never been to Italy a day in their life.

Don't understand why there's an objection towards non-AA stating their ethnicity or heritage.
1st generation Cubans also strongly identify with country of their parents origin over country of residence (and these were mainly non black people when I lived in Miami in the 90s)
 

Femmefatal1981

Well-Known Member
this doesnt seem to be the case with white people. they will tell you their ethnicity, but it does not trump their nationality. the only time the country is primary is if they were born there. it seems to be only black people that want their nationality to take place over their ethnicity.
Hispanics are pretty consistent when it comes to claiming their country. Even 2-3 generations in. they aren't even that concerned with the American part. They identify as Mexican, Cuban, Colombian, Argentinian no matter how long their family has been here.
 

silverbuttons

Not Impressed
So any Caribbean person is now Latino? Or are Haitians Latino bc they share Hispaniola with the DR? Also, no one is saying that Haiti is not in the West Indies. Cuba and Puerto Rico are in the West Indies, but people don't usually call them West Indian. And it was Haitians who came in here initially saying they're not West Indian.

Latino is not Hispanic. Latino refers to groups or nations who were stolen/conquered by those with Latin based languages. (French, Spanish, Portuguese). The English/Dutch Caribbean countries don't fall into this category.

Just because they don't usually call them West Indian doesn't mean they aren't. People don't usually refer to Mexicans as North Americans... yet they are still part of North America.

You live in North America = You are North American.
 

ThirdEyeBeauty

Well-Known Member
Hispanics are pretty consistent when it comes to claiming their country. Even 2-3 generations in. they aren't even that concerned with the American part. They identify as Mexican, Cuban, Colombian, Argentinian no matter how long their family has been here.
Still, it depends on the person. Some assimilate into American cultures fully, partially, or not at all. I think most people keep their ethnicity so that is not unusual.
 

Ayesha81

Well-Known Member
Even thought my parents are from the West Indies I never got involved with West Indians/Africans. I find them to be merciless.
 

Laela

Sidestepping the "lynch mob"
The many threads in this forum highlighting degrading behaviors of blacks is indicative of that statement... some are so hurt by other blacks they will never find anything good to say 'bout black folks and that's a crying shame.


Everyone has encountered an other black who has done them wrong. My thing is don't paint every other black you meet with the same brush otherwise you are no better than WP who paint all of us with the same brush. I don't rep all Kenyans or Africans for that matter. I'm just me. If I hurt you, unless you've met all Kenyan or African women, then you can't judge all of them by my poor behavior.

We complain about black people being seen as lazy, liars, thugs, hood rats or welfare queens and refuse to accept that they represent us when dealing with other races. Why can't we give each other the same treatment internally?

Why are we fighting so hard to hate each other? What is the collective benefit?
 

Laela

Sidestepping the "lynch mob"
:look: LOL

 
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