"i've Picked My Job Over My Kids"

Discussion in 'News - Breaking News & Political Forum' started by aribell, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. kikigirl

    kikigirl Well-Known Member

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    Yes to all of this!!!! Especially the bolded.

    At my workplace paternity leave just jumped from 6 weeks to 5 months!!!! I have at least 3 male colleagues who are taking it now (and imagine the relief it’ll provide to their families). These are attorneys who are as busy as the OP.

    We have to acknowledge the problems and collectively (men and women) find solutions that foster healthy families rather than find out more original ways to farm out all childcare/rearing to others.

    I’ve stopped taking our mothers’ lunches seriously because it’s just a lot of “You go girl! Your kid will be fine!” vs. constructive solutions.
     
  2. Kanky

    Kanky Well-Known Member

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    Parents use the supposed resilience of children as an excuse to continue with bad parenting and as a way to deal with their guilt. The worst of the damage doesn’t show up until years later when the kid can’t manage a healthy marriage and children of his or her own, but parents can pretend that it is “fine” in the moment. The children of drug addicts will also claim to be fine, and some of them grow up to be functioning members of society. But why is the bar so low?

    The focus should be on giving kids a childhood that they don’t have to recover from.
     
  3. KimPossibli

    KimPossibli Supergirl

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    We don't live in a society that values parenting though... not in a tangible way

    if we did there would be more social nets to catch struggling parents...

    mothers and fathers should get parental leave, and I'm not even talking just post partum

    those are things that lead to the needs that children have being met... and those are the things that allow parents to attend to their children rather than being scared to lose their place in the rat race.. or worse yet... having to earn the money that puts food in the smae childrens bodys...
     
  4. kimpaur

    kimpaur Well-Known Member

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    The son at the very least seems to be very well adjusted ,based on his "leaf"

    If you called to report this woman for her supposed neglect they would laugh you off the phone :rolleyes:

    I don't have children but I find this article courageous and bold and I respect it
     
  5. Kanky

    Kanky Well-Known Member

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    Parenting is not so black and white where you are either an awesome parent or CPS should remove your kid. Thinking of it this way makes the standards for caring for children very low. CPS sometimes allows opioid addicts to keep their children and teaches the kids to use narcan. We need higher standards.
     
  6. dicapr

    dicapr Well-Known Member

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    I get what you are saying but that is not what the author of the article was talking about. She admitted that their are times she misses events in her children’s lives not because she has to for job security but because she loves what she does, is highly competitive, and wanted to win. Not the same scenario you are talking about. Not saying she is right or wrong. Just saying she isn’t talking about making choices based on finances.

    For example my dad was in the military. He often had to work long hours, be gone for months even up to a year. It came along with putting food on the table. However, when he was offered an opportunity to become an officer he turned it down. He felt he was already away from his wife and family too much. On one hand he did what he had to do to put food on the table. But then again he also acknowledged that he was not willing to trade what family time he had for career advancement. Men do make the decision to put career on hold every day for family.
     
  7. Everything Zen

    Everything Zen Well-Known Member

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  8. LeftRightRepeat

    LeftRightRepeat Well-Known Member

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    I think that anybody who takes a step back because of their family will be penalized.

    The woman in the OP is divorced and has to work. Some seem to be taking issue with the fact that her husband has to step up and also parent. The irony is that the dad would probably do less parenting if they were still married.

    It also doesn't seem right that she is a mother who likes her job and is ambitious; despite the fact that she mentions that there are times when she prioritizes her children over her job and also that her husband and mother are there to take care of the kids, and they are not being neglected.

    As someone who spent 3 months out of the year with my grandparents, I think all this talk of neglect is a bit dramatic.

    eta: my niece also grew up spending every summer with her grandparents. She is a teenager now and she and her mom are very close (i.e. attached)
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  9. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    Just to play devil's advocate, there are many parents who are around their children constantly who most likely don't do half for their children as this woman.
     
  10. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    But there are store managers doing far less for their children than the woman in the OP. It depends on how you define the job of a parent. If it means to be an active presence in their life majority of their time and to make every event of the child then she may not be doing so well. However is the stay-at-home mother doing well if she is present at every event of the child but the child's life does not contain a rich assortment of events as the mother in the OP? Personally, I would have to observe the child's behavior and feelings to determine how things really are in either case. I know too many fathers who are doing way more work, travel, and less involvement with the children but I know fatherhood is seen completely different and sometimes that type of behavior is expected of them.

    I see parents wanting children to excel and be the best they can with busy careers but the parent does not what the same for themselves. I don't know what they hope for the child as an adult. The point is just to procreate and stop living a life you found fulfilling.
     
  11. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    But you assume the dog would not be taken care of and boarded up. Yes the dog may be with someone else often but the dog may be living in such a rich assortment of fun and training than the dog whose owner is on the couch while it is in a crate.
     
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  12. dicapr

    dicapr Well-Known Member

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    The point isn’t whether or not they are being taken care of. The question is why you would go through the motions of getting something that needs your care if you know you are not capable of giving it the care it needs. Contrary to popular belief providing material things and experiences isn’t the same as providing care.
     
  13. Theresamonet

    Theresamonet Well-Known Member

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    What does that matter to the kids? They don’t get to live two different experiences to compare. My father wasn’t around for me when I was a kid. But he paid a sizable amount of child support and other expenses. The fact that a lot of men don’t pay a dime for their kids or, that some girls are even beaten and molested by their fathers, doesn’t absolve mine of the wrong he did by not giving me and my siblings what we needed, as opposed to just what he was obligated to provide. I understand as an adult that there is always someone worse off than you are. But that’s not often insight that children have, and even if they did, simply knowing things could be worse isn’t always as soothing as one would imagine.
     
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  14. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    Define what is a reasonable time for you.
     
  15. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    Define what is good enough for you.
     
  16. Theresamonet

    Theresamonet Well-Known Member

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    No.
     
  17. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    Are you ok?

    Not sure if you read the article because I am going by some assumptions in that post. Not the scenario you presented.

    No worries we don't have to go any further. I love talking about different scenarios but I never want anyone to feel personally upset.
     
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  18. JudithO

    JudithO Well-Known Member

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    Yep... will she have the closest relationship with her kids as adults, maybe not but there are many ‘present’ parents who cause much more harm. I have a pretty crazy work life but choose to prioritize my family because I simply enjoy them more than my work... if the reverse was true, I’d work more and my kid would survive.
     
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  19. BonBon

    BonBon Well-Known Member

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    Not all children are the same in personality. I especially feel in my background (Caribbean) being an introverted/sensitive type as a child is frowned upon. You're not allowed to be affected by anything. Naturally when these conversations come up only the people who coped amazingly and adapted easily as a child will shout about it and try to shame anyone who felt different. Plenty of people I meet were mildly to majorly affected by the choices their parents made when they were a child and thats OK. Plenty of parents feel like they made the best decision given the circumstances and thats OK too.

    We can't say the children will be fine. Sometimes they will be and sometimes they wont be. It really depeneds.
     
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  20. awhyley

    awhyley "Zexy Lover"

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    As an introverted Caribbean child, I can definitely concur. If I tell you how many times I've heard, "I went through such and such as a child or this thing happened to me when I was little, but I didn't die" and I'm like, wtf?, what is that supposed to mean? Because you didn't die, you're ok then? There are so many train wrecks walking around here because they refuse to accept that they were hurt/affected in childhood and in need of healing.
     
  21. LeftRightRepeat

    LeftRightRepeat Well-Known Member

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    I was an introverted Caribbean child too but nvm to the rest of what i was going to say << delete personal business>>>
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
  22. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    We would have to ask the children how they felt about their parents and life growing up. My point is that it all depends and just because the parent is present all the time and possibly home schooling the child does not mean the children would agree they felt well rounded. It all depends both ways. The feedback is important.
     
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  23. Maracujá

    Maracujá November 2019 --> 13 years natural!!!

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    You and I are >< here! I've learned to keep this thought to myself though, I had no idea so many people enjoyed working so much :look:. To each their own :yep:.
     
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  24. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    Why do you feel you would have to keep your own beliefs on how you want to live your life to yourself? Do you feel people will come to you with little support just like the woman in the OP had she been a member of this forum?
     
  25. Maracujá

    Maracujá November 2019 --> 13 years natural!!!

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    Pretty much yes. I have outlandish beliefs half of the time, often times, when I present them here, I can always find some people that are on board with it. But IRL? Not so much really.

    My same friend, who has decided to breastfeed her second, lives in a huge mansion. She had the opportunity to start a small beauty salon, using natural products in her home. This would have provided her with more independence, in terms of scheduling her daily routines and in turn would've given her more time with her babies.

    When she presented the idea to me, I encouraged her to go through with it. Truthfully speaking, had she been an American woman, she would've gone through with it. But it's just not ingrained here in Europe to manage your own time. So she has now chosen to work for an employer that gives her great hours, but is still pretty far away from home.

    Having lived in Angola and interacted with you ladies on this board, I feel like the wealth of time is placed high up on our list. But not so much here in Belgium, you'll be quick to be labeled as 'lazy' or some other derogative term for not choosing to work full time *shrug*.
     
  26. ThirdEyeBeauty

    ThirdEyeBeauty Well-Known Member

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    ^^^wow I appreciate the perspective. Europe makes it seems that work environment is great there compared to the USA and that may be true in some places. It sounds like they give good benefits and more time off but expect you to work away from home. People with ideas to work from home would be seen as lazy in some cases.
     
  27. Maracujá

    Maracujá November 2019 --> 13 years natural!!!

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    Pretty much. So yes, a full time job here is an average of 36h or 38h per week, as oppose to 40h or more. However, wages are lower than in the US. So most people get a side hustle. This side hustle is not always passive: a guy I worked with at Ikea, worked 36h/week at Ikea, he had a pretty good position. But also worked for 12 years at a restaurant, during the weekends. I was flabbergasted when I found out.

    They do all this to secure their retirement, but at what cost? Most people end up with a bunch of ailments in their latter days, because they overworked themselves to begin with. I am speaking out of experience by the way, thankfully, God woke me up with the quickness.
     
  28. NijaG

    NijaG Well-Known Member

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    I think this is one of the major contributing factors, especially in the States and some other places. No social safety nets to truly accommodate the changes for the various modern family/community structures.

    Majority of physically capable men and women have always worked throughout history. However, multigenerational and small community living enabled parents to work outside and inside the home without always having to always worry about where to keep and place their children.

    Also..... raising children today is vastly different than a few decades ago. The requirements to get children to be fully functional independent adults in today’s society is more costly and burdensome, especially in a society that is determined to recreate historical rigid class system of have and have not’s.

    Women with children (especially young kids) (married/unmarried) in this modern society/family structure have it the worse.

    At the end of the day, I believe a good portion of parents are doing the best they can do. Life is not a bed of roses. Children become adults and will have to figure out what works best for them.
     
  29. Maracujá

    Maracujá November 2019 --> 13 years natural!!!

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    Your post is on point. So glad you brought up the bolded, because it's what I'm witnessing in my close circle. At first I didn't understand why Oprah and Tyler Perry wanted to make a show called 'The have and the have nots'. As time progresses, I understand why.

    Would you care to elaborate on how the problem might be resolved or how you've dealt with it, if you do have children? TIA for your answer.
     
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  30. NijaG

    NijaG Well-Known Member

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    Some of the macro solutions have been discussed/suggested in various thread.


    In the US (macro level)..... longer parental leave. I mean 12 weeks is nothing. Minimum of 9-12 months for moms and 6months for dad’s. I think there are groups advocating for this already in some form.

    This one is harder..... but there has to be some sort of revolution to stop this widening economical gap. It is ridiculous.

    On the individual level..... it depends on a person situation, culture, and other factors.

    I’m Nigerian..... so before my mom has her health crisis, she stayed with me and DH for about 6months with my 1st and we stayed with my MIL for about 6mnths also.

    I took a lower paying job to have flexible time and also I knew I was going to have my second child wanted the a very flexible schedule without too much worry about taking time off.

    I hired a nanny for the 4-5 months after my second baby. I have a cleaner come once a month. My 2nd is almost 2yrs and I just started a new job with standard 8-5pm hrs. I hired a part time nanny to come in the weekday evenings 6-9pm. She helps with the kids, so this enables me to go do my errands, exercise or just relax if needed.

    More deliberate thought and preparation before kids. My first I wasn't as prepared but I had my and DH family and extended support to get me through.
     
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