Tithing, an in-depth study - Discussion Thread Opposed to Tithing

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
This is a great study on tithing that will take you step by step, scripture by scripture, to lay out the truth about tithing and whether or not New Covenant believers (that's you and me) are required to tithe.

Tithing101.com

Here's an excerpt

"This in-depth study of the tithe is for all Christians. Whether you believe tithing ended at the cross, or you believe that tithing was brought into the New Testament, this study will add to your understanding of the tithe.

There are prerequisites to most subjects you study. Before reading a novel written in English, you need a basic understanding of the English language. Before studying the topic of tithing, you need a basic understanding of not only the words used in the bible, but also an understanding of the words you have heard in church. This study of the tithe includes the prerequisites necessary to fully understand the tithe.

We have attempted to organize this course in a logical order so that you will build on your knowledge of the tithe. To get the most out of this course, it is imperative that you study this material in the order presented. Some of the material presented may be new to you and may seem irrelevant to the subject. As you progress through the course, the relevancy will become clear.

This course is biblically based. We base nearly all our conclusions on the scriptures. Anytime a conclusion is based on our opinion, we tell you so.

We take God at His word. We don't draw conclusions based on what sounds good, what sounds right, or what makes us feel good or bad. We do our best to stick with the Word of God. Only the truth will set us free."
 
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Shimmie

"God is the Only Truth -- Period"
Staff member
Re: Tithing, an in-depth study

Do you have a link for this? Thanks.
 

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
Tithing, an in-depth study

Yes we should give to help but Jesus never instructed gentile believers to tithe.... He NEVER did.

Giving and being held to a tithe requirement are two different things.

That is just another pro tithing article, I posted an in-depth study guide that will not just appease us as far as what we've always been told from the the church, but going scripture by scripture and Holy Spirit to help us understand.
 

Shimmie

"God is the Only Truth -- Period"
Staff member
Re: Tithing, an in-depth study

This thread is exclusively for those who choose not to 'Tithe'.

This thread is for discussion; it is not for debates, arguments, attacks, disparagements upon those who do choose to tithe.

The same rule applies in the thread which supports tithing.

Be Blessed Ladies :Rose:
 

JustSitNBePretty

Well-Known Member
Re: Tithing, an in-depth study

Yes we should give to help but Jesus never instructed gentile believers to tithe.... He NEVER did.

Giving and being held to a tithe requirement are two different things.

That is just another pro tithing article, I posted an in-depth study guide that will not just appease us as far as what we've always been told from the the church, but going scripture by scripture and Holy Spirit to help us understand.
I've read that tithing started as a form of taxation but in modern days has turned into a so-called Biblical requirement.

Let me see if I can find a link about it: http://www.biblebb.com/files/tithing.htm

Anyhoo, I believe in giving offerings to the church, especially to support it. Not sure I believe that God requires a certain precise percentage. The human characteristics and beliefs we state of God are so wild to me. I mean, where the heck did the 10% notion even come from? Especially in the days before currency. Laughable!
 

JustSitNBePretty

Well-Known Member
Re: Tithing, an in-depth study

Here is a quote from the link:
ithing is an Old Testament command that was for the Jews and was in reality their "taxation" system. The tithe consisted of the Temple tax, the Land Sabbath Tax, and the Special Profit-Sharing Tax (leaving the corners unharvested, for the poor). The required giving for the Jew was approximately 25 percent per year. In addition to all of this there was voluntary giving in the Old Testament which included first-fruit giving and freewill offerings.

The emphasis here was not on a percentage but on the attitude of the giver and the quality of the gift. The point is that "tithing" is an Old Testament practice that was equivalent to our modern-day tax structure. Tithes were not gifts at all, but were required giving. In the New Testament things really have not changed, for the Christian is still required to pay his taxes to support the government. This taxation is the New Testament equivalent of Tithing. But the Tithe is no longer a part of the "religious system" of a Theocracy, rather our "tithe" today is simply the taxation system of a Democracy. The only references in the New Testament to tithing is to Jews and their requirement to support their religious system of government.

The New Testament does teach that a Christian should give to God but only in the sense that it is freewill giving from the heart. While no specific percentage is given, we are to give: 1. In response to need - Acts 4:35, Acts 11:27-29 2. In a systematic and purposeful manner – 2 Cor. 9:7, 2 Cor. 16:2 3. In a sacrificial way that "costs" us - Mark 12:41-44, Luke 19:8 4. In a secret and humble way - Matthew 6:1-4 5. In a cheerful manner - 2 Cor. 9:7.
 

JustSitNBePretty

Well-Known Member
Re: Discussion Thread for Christians: "Tithing"

I'm sorry, but we are not required to tithe, you cannot "buy" Gods blessings and any increase you have in your life, is because God is sovereign and faithful, not because you tithe money. In fact the tithe was never currency and was never intended to be currency.

Not trying to derail this thread, but I was a tither for years and struggled financially all that time. Yes, I would have little burst of increased finances but would have just as many droughts.

I haven't "tithed" in about three years, but I am constantly sowing into someone's life, financially, emotionally and any way God leads me to and let me tell you, I am blessed beyond measure and not with material things.

Also, if you are going to use Old Testament scripture to support tithing, then there are also many other laws that they followed, are you going to follow those too? Jesus died on the cross to redeem us from the law, why are you trying to go back under the law?

Lastly, you must ask yourself, did Jesus every teach/encourage his disciples to tithe, or did he ever receive a tithe?
THIS! Especially the poster who talking bout you gotta tithe 10% of everything, even before taxes. Like wth? Why would I give away money that the government/rich people get to keep? If everyone should tithe, why doesn't the government give back 10% to our churches? Somethings not right here. Since I can afford it, I give more than 10% to my church, not because I'm tithing but because my church is my community and has helped me get where I am. Also in order for the Black church to continue to be of service to our community, we must support it.
 

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
Shimmie, morning Sis....I'm sorry but you are wrong in your assumptions.



I never said tithing is a sin...NEVER said that!



What I said was that was when you tithe with the expectation of "blessing", you take what Christ did on the cross null and void and you are now following the Law to make yourself right with God.



What is a sin though, is the countless of leaders in ministries using the tithe to push guilt, and threats of being "cursed" by God if they don't tithe.



The link that I posted does NOT support tithing, what it does support is , FREEWILL GIVING!



Excerpt.



"The biblical tithe was always on assets that came from God's labor; never on income or anything that came from man's labor.

Nowhere in the Bible are there any examples of anyone tithing on wages. During these biblical times, there were designers, embroiderers, and weavers (Exodus 35:35); manservants, maidservants, hired workers (Leviticus 25:6); plus many other occupations. Nowhere is there an example of any of these other occupations paying a tithe. There is no example of Jesus tithing on his wages as a carpenter, or Paul tithing on his wages as a tent maker, or even Peter tithing on the fish he caught. ONLY farmers who owned crops and/or animals in herds and flocks tithed.

We believe in generous giving, from the heart, and that the requirement to tithe ended at the cross along with all the other Mosaic laws. However, those who disagree and believe that tithing is still required, need to understand that God required tithing of crops and animals, and never on man's income. God said the tithe belonged to Him, and He gave the tithe to the Levites. If you believe the law to tithe is still valid, then you are breaking that law when you give the tithe to your local church.

God said you tithe on crops and animals which are assets, not income, and come from God's labor. Man says you tithe on income, not assets, which comes from man's labor.

God said the tithe belongs to Him, and He gave it to the Levites. Man says the tithe belongs to God, and you are to give it to your local church (or other christian establishment).

Deuteronomy 4:2 (NIV):
2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.

Scripture is given by God and not to be changed by man. When man changes the scripture, it is no longer the Word of God. Christians are not to adapt the Bible to the times. Christians are to adapt their life to the Bible.

2 Peter 2:1, 3 (NIV):
1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you.
3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up.

2 Timothy 4:1-4 (NIV):
1 In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge:
2 Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.
3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

The choice is yours. Follow tradition, or follow the Word of God.

This completes Part 1 of Tithing Today. To continue to Part 2, click here."



2 Corinthians 9:7 NLT

New Living Translation
You must each make up your own mind as to how much you should give. Don't give reluctantly or in response to pressure. For God loves the person who gives cheerfully.

Regarding being hurt, yes. I was hurt when I finally admitted to myself that I was waiting for my big pay day from God, because that's what I was told, over and over again. I've gone to so many conferences... T.D Jakes, Juanita Bynum, and lesser named Evangelist who ALWAYS point out giving money as a way to get Gods attention.

I was mad at myself for not studying for myself years ago when I had questions, but just burying my head in the sand, so to speak, because giving money is actually an "easy" way to show God how much I love him.

Shimmie, we are not "required" to tithe, and we especially don't need to tithe for blessings. Give to support a ministry if you want, but to put pressure and guilt (as so many of the ladies have expressed in the other threads) is terrible. Those feelings come from erroneous teachings.

Can and will God still bless us whether we tithe or don't tithe, of course he will and can, because he is an awesome, sovereign, faithful GOD!!!
 

Poohbear

Fearfully Wonderfully Made
Re: Tithing, an in-depth study

This thread is exclusively for those who choose not to 'Tithe'.

This thread is for discussion; it is not for debates, arguments, attacks, disparagements upon those who do choose to tithe.

The same rule applies in the thread which supports tithing.

Be Blessed Ladies :Rose:

I would say this thread is for tithers as well, not exclusively for non-tithers. This thread could be an eye-opening opportunity for tithers.

In my humble opinion, many churchgoers have been brainwashed by church leaders to believe tithing is a requirement to please God or that not tithing is a sin against God. Neither case is true.

Jesus came to fulfill the law and He did just that. He is the only way to salvation and eternal security.
 

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
Exactly.....Poohbear

I mean, when did we only respond to threads that we agree with or when did we start deleting post that disagree with the original poster.

I thought that was the purpose of posting, to enlighten one another!

I posted a lot in the original "Tithing Challenge" thread that has been deleted. I wasn't rude or anything, I just disagreed with the original post.
 

Shimmie

"God is the Only Truth -- Period"
Staff member
Exactly.....Poohbear

I mean, when did we only respond to threads that we agree with or when did we start deleting post that disagree with the original poster.

I thought that was the purpose of posting, to enlighten one another!

I posted a lot in the original "Tithing Challenge" thread that has been deleted. I wasn't rude or anything, I just disagreed with the original post.

Sunny...

Your posts in the other thread caused a lot of descension so much so that several posters as well as the OP of the thread and one of our Head Moderators asked if you would start your own thread. It got to the point where the OP asked to have her thread moved from this forum into the Off Topic forum.

Not everyone agrees with your personal views 'against' tithing, yet you will not let go of this and respect the decisions of those who choose to tithe.

Let it go. You have a thread dedicated to discuss your personal views on tithing. Those who tithe have a right to a thread for discussions that support tithng.

Please let it go and respect how they choose to honor the Lord.
 

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
But Shimmie, ok, yes, some posters asked me to "start your own thread", it wasn't the OP who said that, and please don't try and blame me for the OP wanting the thread moved to OT, this is what the OP stated herself

" This isn't necessarily a Christian thread, I'm interested in more of a metaphysical discussion, but I believe the Bible is highly metaphysical. Just wanted to share some inspiration, for those interested, that came from the Bible in regard to tithing."

So please don't do that, then say "let it go".

I never attacked anyone or came at any one person, yes I asked about this "tithing workshop" that was mentioned, but I never attacked the OP for wanting to tithe, but we can't go back and read what I wrote seeing that it's been deleted now!

My personal views.....I've only posted the bible's view.
 

Kurlee

Well-Known Member
both sides of the coin should be discussed respectfully and freely. Are we seeking truth or to be right?
 

JaneBond007

New Member
Question:

Tithing is any different from gifting? Supporting? People warm the benches...lights and heat cost money. They still expect services. What if no one tithed/gifted/financially supported according to their abilities...who would finance baptisms, confirmations, weddings, masses/services, the parish school? Is it that people think tithing is some magical formula? If the very people who attend the church don't give to it, then who should?
 

Poohbear

Fearfully Wonderfully Made
Question:

Tithing is any different from gifting? Supporting? People warm the benches...lights and heat cost money. They still expect services. What if no one tithed/gifted/financially supported according to their abilities...who would finance baptisms, confirmations, weddings, masses/services, the parish school? Is it that people think tithing is some magical formula? If the very people who attend the church don't give to it, then who should?

JaneBond007 (Hey girl, long time no see :wave: ), the answer to your questions can be found in this verse...

2 Corinthians 9:7 (NKJV) "So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver."

This verse does not say you must give 10% of your gross income. Also, the bible never says to give 10% of your gross income anyway in regards to tithing.

This verse is letting us know that we have the freedom to freely give what we can and want to give, whether it's to a church that you attend or to people that are in need. If you feel your funds should go toward the bills of a church building where you attend services, then give what you want to give. You don't necessarily have to give 10% of your gross income and you don't necessarily have to give to just a church building only.

Also, if no one gave one cent to the church, people of faith are to believe God will provide regardless. You can still worship and praise God without money.
 
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sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
Question:

Tithing is any different from gifting? Supporting? People warm the benches...lights and heat cost money. They still expect services. What if no one tithed/gifted/financially supported according to their abilities...who would finance baptisms, confirmations, weddings, masses/services, the parish school? Is it that people think tithing is some magical formula? If the very people who attend the church don't give to it, then who should?


Good question JaneBond007....any organization needs funds to survive, a church is no different. Even Boy Scouts have dues, so giving monetarily to support your local church should not be done out of guilt, there is no minimum-maximum required amount, just as Holy Spirit leads you to.

2 Corinthians 9:7 NLT
New Living Translation
You must each make up your own mind as to how much you should give. Don't give reluctantly or in response to pressure. For God loves the person who gives cheerfully.

To label the giving as "tithe" is the issue....There are certain mandates when it comes to tithes.....and tithing was done according to the law....we are no longer under law, but because of the finished work of Christ, we are under grace.
 

JaneBond007

New Member
@JaneBond007 (Hey girl, long time no see :wave: ), the answer to your questions can be found in this verse...

2 Corinthians 9:7 (NKJV) "So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver."

This verse does not say you must give 10% of your gross income. Also, the bible never says to give 10% of your gross income anyway in regards to tithing.

This verse is letting us know that we have the freedom to freely give what we can and want to give, whether it's to a church that you attend or to people that are in need. If you feel your funds should go toward the bills of a church building where you attend services, then give what you want to give. You don't necessarily have to give 10% of your gross income and you don't necessarily have to give to just a church building only.

Also, if no one gave one cent to the church, people of faith are to believe God will provide regardless. You can still worship and praise God without money.




Hey!!! How'ya! Yeah, I think that people are thinking 10% is some magical formula or that if they don't abide by it, calamity will result. I don't think it's the actual amount but the intent of the heart as well as responsibility and faithful stewardship. In our faith, it's not by individual worship, but as one, the whole body and faith community. We give to support the operation of the church for the benefit of all the body. It takes money. If people spend money on clothing to go to work, to live in homes or pay taxes for schools their children go to (or other peoples' kids), well...this is no different, imho.
 

JaneBond007

New Member
Good question @JaneBond007....any organization needs funds to survive, a church is no different. Even Boy Scouts have dues, so giving monetarily to support your local church should not be done out of guilt, there is no minimum-maximum required amount, just as Holy Spirit leads you to.

2 Corinthians 9:7 NLT
New Living Translation
You must each make up your own mind as to how much you should give. Don't give reluctantly or in response to pressure. For God loves the person who gives cheerfully.

To label the giving as "tithe" is the issue....There are certain mandates when it comes to tithes.....and tithing was done according to the law....we are no longer under law, but because of the finished work of Christ, we are under grace.



Everything in scripture is a preview to what was to come. That's why I say that people are afraid, thinking that calamity will strike. But G-d knows the heart and we will be held accountable for our stewardship. But what I truly want to say about it is that we tend to give more concern to our beauty, leisurely time than we do to supporting the most important work of all.
 

sunnysmyler

Well-Known Member
Tithing and the giving to get theology are deceptive in that both messages rely upon OUR works, and not Gods finished work of salvation which was done at the Cross.

It was completed.

There is nothing we can add to it.

The problem however, is still unbelief.

When Eve was deceived, had she believed God she would not have bowed to the deception. Nothing has changed. Abraham BELIEVED God and it was counted unto him as righteousness, though still under sin.

Christ removed the veil, however the deception of believing there is anything at all in any way to "earn" righteousness, IS FALSE. It simply cannot be done.

When preachers preach and pierce the conscience of those who listen then fall from Grace into condemnation, they rely on a misguided sense of giving to ease the deceptive message, and rather than relying totally on Christ, believe it is what they are doing, rather than what Christ has already done.
 
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