Bible Scholars Help me understand Romans 13

[kally]

It talks about submitting to Government and it is sin not to. The questions I have is what if the Goverment is corrupt and have gotten so far away from God's way of life? I know that God forsees the future. So it would seem that he would not want us to go the way our Gov is set up.

Also I did not know it was consider a sin not to pay taxes. I pay my taxes, but I really don't agree with it.

 

[tffy2004]

This is a good question you bring up. I had never read Romans 13 until I saw your thread.

I think and feel that "Government" isn't "man-made" Government is of God regardless of who is in charge of it. When I say that I mean that Government comes from God he is the one who invented it, government is all up and through the Bible.

For the most part Government is meant to protect the people and to keep order and decency.

Now to answer your question, I understand where you are coming from, but if the laws don't line up with what God commands then who do you obey God or Man?

 

[kally]

This is a good question you bring up. I had never read Romans 13 until I saw your thread.

I think and feel that "Government" isn't "man-made" Government is of God regardless of who is in charge of it. When I say that I mean that Government comes from God he is the one who invented it, government is all up and through the Bible.

For the most part Government is meant to protect the people and to keep order and decency.

Now to answer your question, I understand where you are coming from, but if the laws don't line up with what God commands then who do you obey God or Man?

Def God!!. This is why no matter what I know that it is God who determines who will be the next president.

I guess this is why when I was coming up my parent where big on respecting authority.

 

[alexstin]

Def God!!. This is why no matter what I know that it is God who determines who will be the next president.

I guess this is why when I was coming up my parent where big on respecting authority.

Why do you think God determines who will be the next president? God didn't establish a democratic system, man did... though a godly president is good for our nation. Just wondering.

 

[chicacanella]

Why do you think God determines who will be the next president? God didn't establish a democratic system, man did... though a godly president is good for our nation. Just wondering.

If you look in the old testament, like in Jeremiah, you will see that God allowed certain things to happen or ordered certain things to happen depending on the state of the people in the country. Like, the Israelites, he made it so that Nebudcanezer (sp?) was in charge of them for many years. I was just reading this the other night and explains why so many things happen but in the end;God is still in control and if he doesn't want something to go down, it won't. We still need to pray though.

 

[alexstin]

If you look in the old testament, like in Jeremiah, you will see that God allowed certain things to happen or ordered certain things to happen depending on the state of the people in the country. Like, the Israelites, he made it so that Nebudcanezer (sp?) was in charge of them for many years. I was just reading this the other night and explains why so many things happen but in the end;God is still in control and if he doesn't want something to go down, it won't. We still need to pray though.

Oh, I agree that God does allow things to happen but that doesn't necessarily equate with His perfect will.

 

[Shimmie]

If you look in the old testament, like in Jeremiah, you will see that God allowed certain things to happen or ordered certain things to happen depending on the state of the people in the country. Like, the Israelites, he made it so that Nebudcanezer (sp?) was in charge of them for many years. I was just reading this the other night and explains why so many things happen but in the end;God is still in control and if he doesn't want something to go down, it won't. We still need to pray though.

INDEED Chica, excellent admonishment. We better pray....

As for the children of Isreal under King Nebuchadnezzar's reign. Why did this happen? Because it was first the children of Isreal who chose to serve 'his' gods. They chose to worship idols and to take on the ways of the people under Nebuchadnezzar's reign. And over and over in the word of God you will see where God did this only because they 'chose' to serve the other gods...The OTHER Government. Government opposite of God's order.

Whenever we submit to an unholy ordinance, we subject ourselves to their consequences. The children of Isreal would not listen. They rebelled. They chose not to follow the laws which God had enacted for them to follow. Therefore, they were prisoners of their own design and choosing. God gave them over, for time and again, God called them a rebellious people, a stick necked generation; they chose their god and government under which they'd be ruled.

In regards to the question of this thread. Look at the examples of Daniel, the three Hebrew children (Shaddrach, Meshach, Abinnego), they respected the kings, yet they did not 'bow' to the order.

So such should we. Respect those in authority...yes. Submit to the ungodly order, no. Lest we subject ourselves to the consequences.

 

[shellatl]

Listen to this audio from Sam Soleyn. I think this will clarify the issue for you.

http://www.soleyn.com/Audio/Studio/Prgm40.mp3

 

[kally]

Why do you think God determines who will be the next president? God didn't establish a democratic system, man did... though a godly president is good for our nation. Just wondering.

I have been raised that God appoints authority. Even in Romans it said so.

The problem is that I really Do not like Bush and his style of running things. On the other hand I don't want to disobey God. For example. There was talks of bring back the draft which I am highly against and refuse to do. I don't want God holding something like that against me.

 

[kally]

INDEED Chica, excellent admonishment. We better pray....

As for the children of Isreal under King Nebuchadnezzar's reign. Why did this happen? Because it was first the children of Isreal who chose to serve 'his' gods. They chose to worship idols and to take on the ways of the people under Nebuchadnezzar's reign. And over and over in the word of God you will see where God did this only because they 'chose' to serve the other gods...The OTHER Government. Government opposite of God's order.

Whenever we submit to an unholy ordinance, we subject ourselves to their consequences. The children of Isreal would not listen. They rebelled. They chose not to follow the laws which God had enacted for them to follow. Therefore, they were prisoners of their own design and choosing. God gave them over, for time and again, God called them a rebellious people, a stick necked generation; they chose their god and government under which they'd be ruled.

In regards to the question of this thread. Look at the examples of Daniel, the three Hebrew children (Shaddrach, Meshach, Abinnego), they respected the kings, yet they did not 'bow' to the order.

So such should we. Respect those in authority...yes. Submit to the ungodly order, no. Lest we subject ourselves to the consequences.

Oh yeah I forgot about them. You are right. Thank you for this

 

[alexstin]

I have been raised that God appoints authority. Even in Romans it said so.

The problem is that I really Do not like Bush and his style of running things. On the other hand I don't want to disobey God. For example. There was talks of bring back the draft which I am highly against and refuse to do. I don't want God holding something like that against me.

I understand what you're saying but biblically God has made appointments that He didn't want but His people did. God would have never appointed King Saul but the people wanted a king. That's the point I was trying to make.

 

[kally]

Listen to this audio from Sam Soleyn. I think this will clarify the issue for you.

http://www.soleyn.com/Audio/Studio/Prgm40.mp3

Ok I will have to listen to this when I get home.

 

[kally]

I understand what you're saying but biblically God has made appointments that He didn't want but His people did. God would have never appointed King Saul but the people wanted a king. That's the point I was trying to make.

I see your point and that is a good point to.