lejardinier
New Member
??????????
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Abortion Question
- Thread starter lejardinier
- Start date
Ok... I'll say it:
It would be helpful to use words to articulate a question. As has been stated, the abortion issue is both sensitive and complex and therefore, clarity is helpful in order to cultivate robust responses. Which brings me to another point about the notion of inevitable intensive and reckless conflict from this topic. It is possible to have a "rigorous" conversation about this topic without disrespect. It may be necessary to acknowledge that as this topic has been posted in the CHRISTIAN FELLOWSHIP FORUM, it should be expected that some (majority?) of the responses would align with the range of Christian beliefs as put forth from Christianity...at least the broad strokes of the faith....
I'll leave it at that.
It would be helpful to use words to articulate a question. As has been stated, the abortion issue is both sensitive and complex and therefore, clarity is helpful in order to cultivate robust responses. Which brings me to another point about the notion of inevitable intensive and reckless conflict from this topic. It is possible to have a "rigorous" conversation about this topic without disrespect. It may be necessary to acknowledge that as this topic has been posted in the CHRISTIAN FELLOWSHIP FORUM, it should be expected that some (majority?) of the responses would align with the range of Christian beliefs as put forth from Christianity...at least the broad strokes of the faith....
I'll leave it at that.
Actually it will NEVER matter what man says or what man thinks. It what God says. "Thou Shalt Not Kill". Period! That will never change.
For those who call themselvs Christians and 'Pro-Choice".... Hmmmmm. "Choose you this day whom you will serve..." God says plainly that He has called Heaven and earth as His witness, "Choose Life or Death, blessing or cursing...therefore choose Life". Period. It's just that plain.
It does not matter what man/woman says in opposition to this. Those who call themselves Christian had better consider that they lie to themselves and to the Lord, for Jesus plainly said, "Why call unto me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things I command?"
You cannot have it YOUR way. It's God's way and no other. You can say that you can as long as you want, but God's way will never change just for one to have 'their' way. It won't. period.
For a man's ways and thoughts MAY seem right to him, but the way thereof is destruction.
Just admit the truth of the matter. That you disagree with God. And you do, totally. Though you may call yourself Christian, you still have problems adhering to and accepting the Truth which He commands, which is 'Thou Shalt Not Kill'.
We do not make the rules...He does and there is nothing that anyone can say or do about it. Nothing! You can quote 'I disagree' or you call turn blue, black or even green in the face, but it still will not change just because you disagree. It won't. It simply won't.
Keep living and eventually you will have to honor it as God's command or die with a lie.
To the OP, I agree, for this cause there are women who need loving support and to know that they can get past this and start over again. I applaude your love and concern for this much needed ministry.
This IS the Christianity forum and in Christianity we honor life, not destroy it. There is no such thing as giving Pro Choice to kill.
For those who call themselvs Christians and 'Pro-Choice".... Hmmmmm. "Choose you this day whom you will serve..." God says plainly that He has called Heaven and earth as His witness, "Choose Life or Death, blessing or cursing...therefore choose Life". Period. It's just that plain.
It does not matter what man/woman says in opposition to this. Those who call themselves Christian had better consider that they lie to themselves and to the Lord, for Jesus plainly said, "Why call unto me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things I command?"
You cannot have it YOUR way. It's God's way and no other. You can say that you can as long as you want, but God's way will never change just for one to have 'their' way. It won't. period.
For a man's ways and thoughts MAY seem right to him, but the way thereof is destruction.
Just admit the truth of the matter. That you disagree with God. And you do, totally. Though you may call yourself Christian, you still have problems adhering to and accepting the Truth which He commands, which is 'Thou Shalt Not Kill'.
We do not make the rules...He does and there is nothing that anyone can say or do about it. Nothing! You can quote 'I disagree' or you call turn blue, black or even green in the face, but it still will not change just because you disagree. It won't. It simply won't.
Keep living and eventually you will have to honor it as God's command or die with a lie.
To the OP, I agree, for this cause there are women who need loving support and to know that they can get past this and start over again. I applaude your love and concern for this much needed ministry.
This IS the Christianity forum and in Christianity we honor life, not destroy it. There is no such thing as giving Pro Choice to kill.
lejardinier
New Member
I originally had a paragraph up and wanted to get rid of it ASAP. I edited it but wasn't able to submit unless I put something in the content box. I left the off topic forum to come to this forum because of the rules that are posted on this forum. I thought that I could get my questioned answered, but I don't think it's possible. If you know of a way for me to completely remove everything please let me know. I've sent a PM to the moderator. Thanks.
lejardinier
New Member
Dear Shimmie,
I am in tears here as I read your answer. I didn't want to start anything up in this forum which is why I left off topic thinking that I could get an answer to my question. I read the rules and thought that this was the Christian Fellowship Forum which is why I came here. Thank you so much for your answer. I really appreciate the fact that you took the time.
I am in tears here as I read your answer. I didn't want to start anything up in this forum which is why I left off topic thinking that I could get an answer to my question. I read the rules and thought that this was the Christian Fellowship Forum which is why I came here. Thank you so much for your answer. I really appreciate the fact that you took the time.
cheetarah1980
Well-Known Member
You can't legislate morals/what people believe. Abortion goes against my Christian beliefs. But far be it for me to put my beliefs on anyone else. God doesn't want us to follow him out of compulsion, but rather the desire of our heart.
That's a big comment, but only that a comment, that satan uses to deceive and trip people up. For if Jesus, Himself were to come down and confront you concerning this, you'd bow your head in shame, for did He not say, "I came to give Life and Life everlasting..." The life Jesus gave us does not include abortion. Abortion is death of a baby...a life which is given by God.
Jesus isn't going to come down to face you with this and you are fully aware of it. He knows it's just 'talk' and pride. He also knows it would scare you to death, literally. For His glory alone made all hell to tremble; it would surely tremble you. You can't have it the world's way and love Jesus. He says, "If you love me, you'll keep my commandments".
I don't doubt that you believe in Jesus Christ, but it has to be all the way and His way, not ours. It will always be His way.
Peace and Blessings to you.
MizzBrown
Well-Known Member
In total agreement.
True we can't, But are we to allow the world to shut our rights down by voicing their foolishness and expecting us not to 'minister' truth.
I'm not forcing anything, but I will tell the truth and I refuse to apologize for it. That's why the world is in such a mess now. They're getting away with far too much and we're not speaking up.
I'm not in diagreement with what you are saying...I know where you're coming from, yet we still have to let what we know to be the truth be heard just as loud as the world utters its lies and foolishness. Abortions have messed up too many persons lives to be quiet about it. Whoever has pride in abortion has a serious problem.
Cichelle
Well-Known Member
If that was to me (and I'm not saying it was...just in case), you don't have to worry. My only contribution to this thread was going to be to direct people to a source that explains the views of some Christians who are pro-choice. A "rigorous" conversation generally includes more than one perspective. However, I have no interest in personally being a part of the conversation in an environment such as this, where the views of people of other religions are not welcome.
Peace.
MizzBrown
Well-Known Member
LOL, you may not want to know at this point.
gone_fishing
New Member
What did the original post say?
lejardinier
New Member
I asked the moderators to help me out because I didn't know how to edit myself out of here. I left off topic because I read the rules here and thought that I could get my question answered. I don't want to cause a problem with my abortion question anymore and I thought I could get it answered in the Christian forum because my question was about God condoning abortion and whether or not we could come together to help women who choose to keep their babies and women who are suffering from post-abortion trauma. Thanks for your question. Hope my answer helps.
Ask the mods to lock or delete this thread. (If this is your conclusion)
MizzBrown
Well-Known Member
OFF TOPIC but I LOVE your Signature quote. If that aint the truth then I don't know what is.
I didn't mean to come in and make this a 'bad' thread. I'm sorry if I made you cry 'sad', hurtful tears.
I support what you are sharing. Because abortion is wrong, there has to be a 'haven' where women who have had abortions can come and re-live their lives again in peace and not torment of the past.
We've ALL sinned and still are sinners and we ALL have fallen short of God's expectations. Things in life happen! They happen! Women are raped, molested, and have been impregnated via means which were outside of love.
I am a child of a rape victim. My grandmother was raped by her brother-in-law, her sister's husband when she was 12 years old. She gave birth to my father at the age of 13. As a matter of fact she had him on her 13the Birthday, on March 13. YET, she kept my father...a Blessing indeed.
And had she not, I would not be here.
Now I know this may be headache for hell and for several persons on this forum, but I'm here in this life and earth where God has placed me and I'm not going anywhere until He says so.
I know there are extenuating circumstances for which many women feel they are justified to abort. But it's still not God's way nor His plan or command. It's not. As much and as sad as these circumstances are, it still doesn't change God's command. When it comes to choosing the life between a mother and child, that's a decision that has nothing to do with Pro-Choice, it's between God and the person involved.
As for Pro Choice, too many women are having abortions as a means of birth control for foolish recreation. That's uncalled for and it's wrong. These persons have a problem with Life and making rational decisions.
Yet, there are those who were just 'lost' and hurting, having no answers and gave in to having an abortion. It happens and this is where your heart for ministry comes into play. All of these women need love, no matter what precluded in their lives. They all need and deserve love and ministry.
We just can't sit back and allow the world to suck them in with the lie that abortion is pro choice, when it truth is is pro death.
Peace and love to you, angel. Say what you have to say. Everyone else and or will. Speak it and move on to where God leads you. Don't concern yourself with who agrees or disgrees. The truth is that no one owns Heaven or hell to put you in. God does. AND it is He whom we are to be concerned, and live in peace with Him.
To have a ministry for women who have had abortions. An outreach of love and support.
Welcome and hospitality can be subjective and according to personal perception. I think to state that the Christian forum is where one might find Christian-laced opinions is not inherently inhospitable.
I don't believe you and I have had any negative encounters in any forum. I respect what you bring to the conversation and I don't think you feel that uncomfortable here....(Smile)....
I wish the OP had kept her question open for us to think about and speak to.... that's a beautiful and needed ministry....
It definitely is a beautiful and much needed ministry.
She didn't want to start any trouble here. The posts that followed her Opening Post gave her the impression that it would cause a big uproar over here and she didn't want that to happen. I admire what she wants to do and she chose to do it here. She has a 'peaceful' heart.
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MizzBrown
Well-Known Member
But where are they? That's why I think a lot of women take their abortions to their grave. Their own church members silently and verbally judge them and there isn't an outreach program in sight for them. When the elders do see a woman with 2 or 3 kids and can barely support herself with no father around because she chose to keep them, then they talk about her then as well.
I've seen it on both sides and I know someone who doesn't think I know that she had an abortion and i think she is taking it to the grave. The minute she says something to the tune of her having one, who knows what will happen.
And in all honesty,what church do you know will have a ministry like this? That's the scary part. Not mine. They mean well, but try saying something as controversial as such and its a totally different story.
I've seen it on both sides and I know someone who doesn't think I know that she had an abortion and i think she is taking it to the grave. The minute she says something to the tune of her having one, who knows what will happen.
And in all honesty,what church do you know will have a ministry like this? That's the scary part. Not mine. They mean well, but try saying something as controversial as such and its a totally different story.
\
Shimmie! (((HUGS))):
The BIBLE says in Matthew 11:12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force."
I like this translation: "From the days of John the Baptist until now, the holy nation of heaven has suffered very much. Fighting men try to take it." (NLV)
The OP can't concern herself about causing an uproar. Look at her ministry! Now that's gonna start an uproar! An uproar for good!
But the LORD is our light and our salvation! Whom shall we fear? The Lord is the strength of our life, of whom shall we be afraid? When sinful men, and all who hated me, came against me to destroy my flesh, they tripped and fell."
We are victorious in the Lord Jesus Christ!
LaRobinWolfe76
New Member
I will say this and I'll make it short and sweet just like me (LOL) just trying to bring some light to this serious topic.
Anyway, I am a christian woman and we all fall short and yes Jesus is the only perfect christian there was, is and ever will be this is why he took on our past, present and future sins. Your struggles are not mine and mine are not yours but we all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God and all sin is the same in God's eyes and I can say that because in 2003 after my divorce I became pregnant with a child the father did not want me to have it and so I consulted my mother and she told me I was a strong woman and that I made it with 2 alone so I could make it with 3 alone and I said I can't. I'm 20 weeks/5 mos and I don't know what to do and she said well I don't know what to tell you I only know God is the only one who is ordained to give and take life you just need to pray about it and she hung the phone up on me. I cried so hard and I fell on my knees it was on a Sunday evening I told the Lord the situation was too much for me to bear alone and I needed deliverance on Tuesday I took my final exams on Wednesday morning I was on my way to drop my daughter off to the sitters house that was 5 blocks away from mine and a passenger van struck me on my driver's side and the force caused my car to flip over and my dughter was in the seat behind me and both her and I was dangling from the car the baby was killed instantly and 3 days later I delivered a stillborn. Due to the injuries from the accident and the complications from the delivery to my amazement and astonishment in May of this year I again became pregnant by my fiance and he said that he didn't want me to have the baby and I again said I didn't believe in abortion and I was going to carry out the pregnancy and somehow at 20 weeks/5 mos I went to find out the sex of the baby and there was no heartbeat and I again delivered a stillborn at 20 weeks and it baffled the doctors on how I miscarried 2 babies at 20 weeks that I wanted very much and the fathers didn't but the one thing I stood firm on was God's will and his word despite the fact that I am a sinner God's love, grace and mercy is sufficient, everlasting and unchanging and no action comes without consequences. The pain of the trauma of having to deliver a stillborn baby will forever be with me and believe it or not the first was a little girl named Alycia Marie and the second was a boy named Andrew Christian and I can tell you this if it hurts this bad and I didn't cause it I don't know how I could have dealt with it knowing I did.
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All I can do is give you a big sister hug...you've really come through a lot and I admire your strength. God bless you.
Excellent RR...Excellent
satan will always challenge and try to hinder what's not on his agenda. Ministering love to those who have had an abortion, is definitely not on his agenda. he would love to see women living in torment and not knowing that God still loves them and wants them to begin again.
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