Jealous of A Cancer Survivor's Hair Growth: Growth vs Texture

[Neith]

Yes. Because this word "kinky" is not the same as "nappy".

Non-Blacks with kinkier hair, it seems like their hair grows faster too.

Or Black men with the kinkiest or nappiest or whatever you want to call it, their hair grows or "seems" to grow faster too.

What's the difference between kinky and nappy? I use them as synonyms...

So if kinky/nappy haired men grow their hair out quickly, why is it different for women?

 

[Xerxes]

I don't know why is it such a crime on this board to say that genetics/hair types play a role in rate of growth.
Whateva.

Because the prevailing dogma of this board is that with the right regimen, you too can have swangin' WSL hair. <shrug>

I just think that alot of BW with short hair do have a legitimate excuse.

I don 't know if it is genetic or not but I do KNOW for sure that some people experience quicker growth than others even when both have healthy hair.

I consider myself to be a moody hair grower. Most months it is slow and then I can get a growth spurt.

It is what it is. I am learning to accept that. It is diifficult when you see folks growth progress and you know you have had no setbacks your hair is healthy but it did not grow like the person posting those pictures.

It gets real frustrating when the people who have the same hair texture can grow hair quicker than you can.UOTE]

You know what, I have never seen a 4b+ with hair growth that made me jealous. I've seen 4b+'s with long hair, but it took 5 or more years for the them to grow it. I have seen frizzy 4A's who I mistakenly identify as a 4B type until her coils/curls get defined by product and once I identify her as what she truly is, then her quicker hair growth/length doesn't impress me.

I think genetics do play a role in hair growth. But I think it's wrong to lump all black people or all white people together because of their race. The genetic differences within races, especially the black race, is much larger than between races. So just because one black person's hair grows slow does not mean that every black person is going to have slow growing hair. If you take a look at the members on this site, you'll notice differences in the rate of hair growth even though many of us are black. I think we need to pay some attention to individual genetic differences not just racial differences.

Oh, I did not lump all blacks together, that's why I mentioned hair texture which is based on genetics. The individual differences always abound, but it is also important to note that racial groups do have disparities and that should not be ignored (i.e. Cystic Fibrosis, Sickle Cell, etc). Kinkier hair is definitely a genetic trait that is associated with blacks although each individual's hair may vary.

 

[Taina]

I'm not trying to be funny because I am admittedly annoyed right now, so I'll just say please PM me when you meet your next hair growth goal.

I just think that as long as you aren't giving yourself bad relaxers (overprocessing) and/or frying your hair with heat, your hair regimen doesn't matter.

Your hair will grow at it's pre-ordained growth rate regardless of what you do and then retention is probably 50/50 genetics and nurture.

That's maybe my problem with all the grow long hair come from. I've never wanted to achieve an specific hair lenght, but i'm so in to have a healthy hair. Healthy hair grows!! Most of the people wants to have long hair despite their hair status, if the hair is in a bad situation all the products that you put on it are going to be destinated to repair the damage and not grow at all.

You just have to look at the pictures of the ladies in the board. When started taking care of their hair, most of the times is damaged and when the hair starts to grow is healthy and thick.

And sorry about my first post it supposed to say Race no genetics.

 

[Xerxes]

erm if you say you haven't seen true 4bs, cnapps with beyond mbl hair you should check out fotki and youtube, they are out there there was a long thread on here (it was a sticky) about one such lady.
eta: sera252

Erm. Yeah... type 1 hair and type 4a are much more closely related texturewise than type 4a and 4b.

Oookay. erplexed

Just because you have never seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Also... have you ever done a search for long haired 4b's on this site?

Here is a thread that lists several:

http://www.longhaircareforum.com/showthread.php?t=214279

I'm not saying that 4b+ WSLs don't exist, Im just saying that they are a much smaller group than WSL's of other hair types. In other words, there's far too few of them and I think genetics not nurture is to blame.

 

[Xerxes]

Hey, none of those chicks were WSL nor were they all 4Bs! LOL

Link:http://www.longhaircareforum.com/for...d.php?t=214279

 

[Neith]

I'm not saying that 4b+ WSLs don't exist, Im just saying that they are a much smaller group than WSL's of other hair types. In other words, there's far too few of them and I think genetics not nurture is to blame.

Okay...

For the record, I have never seen a woman with cottony-textured hair like mine ever reach MBL+

Just a miscommunication then... I thought you said you have never seen any.


Imo, even with nurture our hair breaks/gets damaged way easier. I don't think it's the growth that is vastly different.

I live with a (white) type 1 and our hair grows basically at the same rate. ( the average 6 inches a year)

Then again, I'm 4a... so in your eyes I don't count. lol

 

[msa]

Explain how you don't see genetics as having anything to do with race, surely most see the two as having something to do with each other despite the whole social construct thing.

I can't say for sure they're not related all I can say is that I really don't believe growth rate is based on race. I think growth rate has more to do with other genetic factors but I can't say what those might be because I don't know. Until someone does some real scientific research on it, all we can do is speculate.

Either way, I guess I'm just not hung up on how fast my hair grows. I'm more worried about keeping it on my head.

 

[Foxglove]

Considering I watch my ecuadorian friend grow her hair from SL to WL every year then cut off over 10 inches to donate
Watched my chinese classmate grow her hair from SL to WL yearly and chop it off
Watch my indian classmates grow and chop off more hair in a few months than I've grown in a year (I've actually measured my hair growth in braids)

I'm going to have to agree with the OP
Even with our speediest hair growers I haven't seen anything like that from black people in real life or in the boards

 

[Taina]

I am with the OP on this rant!

Non-black people do as much if not more damage to their hair as well do. Heat, not sleeping on satin, junk food.

This is like the magic question that this board tries to avoid, but the OP is right, is a cause for a rant. Our hair ain't that dry and brittle, if it was, it wouldn't stay on our head!

I ate junk foods my whole life (that's why i'm obese) i never slepped on a satin pillowcase i used to go to dominican saloons every week and flat iron my hair every week and the hair still growing. So that's why i don't really rhink it have to be with race. C'mon i'm black and my hair grow.

ge⋅net⋅ics

–noun (used with a singular verb

) 1. Biology. the science of heredity, dealing with resemblances and differences of related organisms resulting from the interaction of their genes and the environment.



race

1. a group of persons related by common descent or heredity. 2. a population so related. 3. Anthropology. a. any of the traditional divisions of humankind, the commonest being the Caucasian, Mongoloid, and Negro, characterized by supposedly distinctive and universal physical characteristics: no longer in technical use. b. an arbitrary classification of modern humans, sometimes, esp. formerly, based on any or a combination of various physical characteristics, as skin color, facial form, or eye shape, and now frequently based on such genetic markers as blood groups. c. a human population partially isolated reproductively from other populations, whose members share a greater degree of physical and genetic similarity with one another than with other humans. 4. a group of tribes or peoples forming an ethnic stock: the Slavic race. 5. any people united by common history, language, cultural traits, etc.: the Dutch race. 6. the human race or family; humankind: Nuclear weapons pose a threat to the race. 7. Zoology. a variety; subspecies. 8. a natural kind of living creature: the race of fishes. 9. any group, class, or kind, esp. of persons: Journalists are an interesting race. 10. the characteristic taste or flavor of wine.

 

[Hairsofab]

When my mom was recovering from cancer back in the mid 90's my whole family was amazed at how fast her hair grew back. She went from no hair at all to shoulder length in 12 months or less. I was also amazed that her hair grew back a totally different texture. She was 4a/3c before and she is now 3c/3b.

This is probably a topic for a whole other thread. But I think there is something to hair texture and catastrophic illness and maybe the medications you take for them. My mom said that my grandmother's hair texture changed after she got cancer. She survived her first cancer bout and I always knew my grandma with straightish(not pin straight but straight) hair. My mom always had lose textured hair (3a? 2b?) but she became ill and had to be hospitalized, and her hair grew in more wavy/straight. So I wonder if it is something about illness or something about the medications that makes the hair follicle change.

 

[AvaSpeaks]

Oh, yes I did clump all of those types together! LOL

Firstly, I was not going to type out all of those possible hair type options and then secondly, I see a marked difference in the numbers of women with BSL hair with Type 4B+ hair compared to others. Also, Type 4As are a heterogeneous group filled with what I consider poorly defined 3Cs. Hair with curls get a pass in my 4b-z worldview.

For the record, I have never seen a woman with cottony-textured hair like mine ever reach MBL+. So that is why I try to keep the true kinky, devoid of all definition hair separate from the others.

And yes, we all have issues, but I'm focused on my hair type. lol



Explain how you don't see genetics as having anything to do with race, surely most see the two as having something to do with each other despite the whole social construct thing.




I know our hair grows, I just hate being on the wrong side of the bell curve! LMAO

I just wish I could slow everyone else's hair growth rate down and then catch up. Or if I could just jump to June 2010 and if I'm still not APL, I'll take a hostage or succumb to getting my first weave, but then I'll feel like a RHOA... I don't want to look like Kim or Nene!

Ok, I think the rant is passing, I'm smiling again.

On the flip side.

I think also our quest to have long hair is societal. I mean it's ingrained in us that long hair is beautiful, so we want it, especially seeing our young Black girls in school. When I was growing up really young, I wanted hair that would swing. I was especially jealous of a brown skin girl that had long hair. I would think to myself, how did she get that hair? And when I found out my dark-skinned mom had long, "good" hair growing up, I really got a hair complex then

 

[Xerxes]

Okay...



Just a miscommunication then... I thought you said you have never seen any.


Imo, even with nurture our hair breaks/gets damaged way easier. I don't think it's the growth that is vastly different.

I live with a (white) type 1 and our hair grows basically at the same rate. ( the average 6 inches a year)

Then again, I'm 4a... so in your eyes I don't count. lol

OIC, why you're confused! LMAO

My two statements are not contradictory. lol I have never seen a true 4b+ MBL+ woman, but I don't doubt they exist, there are just not enough of them. And those albums didn't show me any. And yes, as a 4A, you don't count to me. But I still like your input! LOL

 

[naijamerican]

I've quietly pondered to myself whether or not Black women have comparatively slower hair growth because, from an evolutionary standpoint, we were meant to reside in sunny areas.

Then I think of Indians and other aboriginal peoples and I realize that that theory is hogwashish at best.

All of that is to say that once and for all, we need to stop conflating hair texture with hair growth. 4B+ WLS don't exist because it is only recently that Black women are coming to terms with how to properly grow their hair. And they DO exist - those women who endeavor to take care of their hair are able to grow it out. Look at Mwedzi and I defy anyone to say that someone with 4A/B hair can't grow it out.

I don't take issue with the notion that women of other races are able to grow their hair faster or longer (even though I disagree with it). But to solely blame genetics when the sample size isn't even large is enough is, in my humble opinion, a huge mistake.

 

[Neith]

Hey, none of those chicks were WSL nor were they all 4Bs! LOL

Link:http://www.longhaircareforum.com/for...d.php?t=214279

I didn't actually go look at every link posted there... I just did a quick search. If you actually do want to see wl 4b hair, you could do your own searches.

And check youtbe too... I love this lady's hair

http://www.youtube.com/user/Sera2544

 

[AvaSpeaks]

What's the difference between kinky and nappy? I use them as synonyms...

So if kinky/nappy haired men grow their hair out quickly, why is it different for women?

Another magic question. What are Black AMERICAN women during to their hair? Because Black women in other parts of the world, including some African countries have no problems growing their hair at least to their shoulders. Why what's with Black American women?

As far as the kinky/nappy hair. I think people say kinky now, it's PC for nappy. I think

 

[naijamerican]

Another magic question. What are Black AMERICAN women during to their hair? Because Black women in other parts of the world, including some African countries have no problems growing their hair at least to their shoulders. Why what's with Black American women?

As far as the kinky/nappy hair. I think people say kinky now, it's PC for nappy. I think

One thank you is not enough. And that's all I'm going to say on this matter.

 

[Xerxes]

On the flip side.

I think also our quest to have long hair is societal. I mean it's ingrained in us that long hair is beautiful, so we want it, especially seeing our young Black girls in school. When I was growing up really young, I wanted hair that would swing. I was especially jealous of a brown skin girl that had long hair. I would think to myself, how did she get that hair? And when I found out my dark-skinned mom had long, "good" hair growing up, I really got a hair complex then

Aw!

I ate junk foods my whole life (that's why i'm obese) i never slepped on a satin pillowcase i used to go to dominican saloons every week and flat iron my hair every week and the hair still growing. So that's why i don't really rhink it have to be with race. C'mon i'm black and my hair grow.

ge⋅net⋅ics

–noun (used with a singular verb

) 1. Biology. the science of heredity, dealing with resemblances and differences of related organisms resulting from the interaction of their genes and the environment.



race

1. a group of persons related by common descent or heredity. 2. a population so related. 3. Anthropology. a. any of the traditional divisions of humankind, the commonest being the Caucasian, Mongoloid, and Negro, characterized by supposedly distinctive and universal physical characteristics: no longer in technical use. b. an arbitrary classification of modern humans, sometimes, esp. formerly, based on any or a combination of various physical characteristics, as skin color, facial form, or eye shape, and now frequently based on such genetic markers as blood groups. c. a human population partially isolated reproductively from other populations, whose members share a greater degree of physical and genetic similarity with one another than with other humans. 4. a group of tribes or peoples forming an ethnic stock: the Slavic race. 5. any people united by common history, language, cultural traits, etc.: the Dutch race. 6. the human race or family; humankind: Nuclear weapons pose a threat to the race. 7. Zoology. a variety; subspecies. 8. a natural kind of living creature: the race of fishes. 9. any group, class, or kind, esp. of persons: Journalists are an interesting race. 10. the characteristic taste or flavor of wine.

Thank you so freaking much for that. Now, we don't have to complain about genetics vs race anymore.

Considering I watch my ecuadorian friend grow her hair from SL to WL every year then cut off over 10 inches to donate
Watched my chinese classmate grow her hair from SL to WL yearly and chop it off
Watch my indian classmates grow and chop off more hair in a few months than I've grown in a year (I've actually measured my hair growth in braids)

I'm going to have to agree with the OP
Even with our speediest hair growers I haven't seen anything like that from black people in real life or in the boards

TRUE!!

I can't say for sure they're not related all I can say is that I really don't believe growth rate is based on race. I think growth rate has more to do with other genetic factors but I can't say what those might be because I don't know. Until someone does some real scientific research on it, all we can do is speculate.

Either way, I guess I'm just not hung up on how fast my hair grows. I'm more worried about keeping it on my head.

It's a two-step process, retention isn't my problem, so I focus on what is.

 

[Carrie A]

This is probably a topic for a whole other thread. But I think there is something to hair texture and catastrophic illness and maybe the medications you take for them. My mom said that my grandmother's hair texture changed after she got cancer. She survived her first cancer bout and I always knew my grandma with straightish(not pin straight but straight) hair. My mom always had lose textured hair (3a? 2b?) but she became ill and had to be hospitalized, and her hair grew in more wavy/straight. So I wonder if it is something about illness or something about the medications that makes the hair follicle change.

Definately medications. You see a lot of hair texture change with chronic illness itself, especially diseases that compromise the immune system like HIV/AIDS, kidney failure, and liver failure.

 

[cmw45]

Oh, yes I did clump all of those types together! LOL

Firstly, I was not going to type out all of those possible hair type options and then secondly, I see a marked difference in the numbers of women with BSL hair with Type 4B+ hair compared to others. Also, Type 4As are a heterogeneous group filled with what I consider poorly defined 3Cs. Hair with curls get a pass in my 4b-z worldview.

For the record, I have never seen a woman with cottony-textured hair like mine ever reach MBL+. So that is why I try to keep the true kinky, devoid of all definition hair separate from the others.

And yes, we all have issues, but I'm focused on my hair type. lol



Explain how you don't see genetics as having anything to do with race, surely most see the two as having something to do with each other despite the whole social construct thing.




I know our hair grows, I just hate being on the wrong side of the bell curve! LMAO

I just wish I could slow everyone else's hair growth rate down and then catch up. Or if I could just jump to June 2010 and if I'm still not APL, I'll take a hostage or succumb to getting my first weave, but then I'll feel like a RHOA... I don't want to look like Kim or Nene!

Ok, I think the rant is passing, I'm smiling again.

LMBAO!!!...

 

[Carrie A]

Another magic question. What are Black AMERICAN women during to their hair? Because Black women in other parts of the world, including some African countries have no problems growing their hair at least to their shoulders. Why what's with Black American women?

As far as the kinky/nappy hair. I think people say kinky now, it's PC for nappy. I think

Too many Saturdays in the salon getting that fly cut.

 

[tocktick]

I believe the issue is retention and not growth. Of course, there are some people who are genetically prone to growth quicker than average. However, until I see some solid evidence to suggest that on average non-blacks grow hair significantly faster than us, I will keep on believing the issue is to do with retention. Thus, the anecdotal evidence people come up with are really not enough to convince me. But if we are sharing anecdotal evidence, I'll add my own. I lived with an Afghanistan man and noticed that his hair grew a lot within the 9 months we lived together. However, so did mine. The reason his hair showed more of a difference was because he never trimmed. Meanwhile, I did and I manipulated my hair far too much (a big mistake). I also lived with a girl from Iran and her hair appeared to grow at the normal rate.

I see too many people here reach their goals in good time once they have their regimen down to believe our issue as a whole is slow growth. The only place I think non-black hair has a boost (retention wise) is the extra cuticle layers that allows their hair to withstand more wear and tear. Also, the less curly the hair the easier it is for it not to knot up and tangle (imo). Despite that, black hair can grow long and healthy with the right care.

 

[Neith]

OIC, why you're confused! LMAO

My two statements are not contradictory. lol I have never seen a true 4b+ MBL+ woman, but I don't doubt they exist, there are just not enough of them. And those albums didn't show me any. And yes, as a 4A, you don't count to me. But I still like your input! LOL

I didn't know you were talking about in real life.

Yeah, real life is not like lhcf sadly. Don't get me wrong, I do see black people with long hair daily, but it's not as common as short hair.

I never thought when I went natural anyone would imply my hair isn't "nappy enough"

but it's happened about 4 or 5 times.

It's strange, I don't agree that 4b is all that different from 4a, but yeah... we're entitled to our own opinions.

 

[dachsies_rule!]

Hair growth is a combination of genes and nurture, but i don't believe it's race related. If it were related to race than all black hair would grow at the same rate and the same for other races. I've seen black people who can grow 1-1.5 inches per month and white people who only get 0.5 inch per month. But good genes can't help you if you don't take care of your hair and it breaks off as fast as it grows!

 

[Neith]

Another magic question. What are Black AMERICAN women during to their hair? Because Black women in other parts of the world, including some African countries have no problems growing their hair at least to their shoulders. Why what's with Black American women?

As far as the kinky/nappy hair. I think people say kinky now, it's PC for nappy. I think

I really don't know much about haircare in Africa...

but I know that in the USA and probably some European countries, good hair care practices are not very widely known.

There's nothing "with" us though.

I wish more people did seek the info out

 

[msa]

It's a two-step process, retention isn't my problem, so I focus on what is.

Oh ok. I guess I don't see my slow growth as a problem. Especially because everyone's hair is always growing.

 

[MrsHdrLe]

I don 't know if it is genetic or not but I do KNOW for sure that some people experience quicker growth than others even when both have healthy hair.

I consider myself to be a moody hair grower. Most months it is slow and then I can get a growth spurt.

It is what it is. I am learning to accept that. It is diifficult when you see folks growth progress and you know you have had no setbacks your hair is healthy but it did not grow like the person posting those pictures.

It gets real frustrating when the people who have the same hair texture can grow hair quicker than you can.

^^^And everyone "OHHS" and "AHHHs" but shorter haired (less than APL/BSL) 4b (kinky textured) people barely get any notice (they get plenty of looks though) Sorry I joined the rant

 

[ellehair]

I didn't know you were talking about in real life.

Yeah, real life is not like lhcf sadly. Don't get me wrong, I do see black people with long hair daily, but it's not as common as short hair.

I just actually did a poll.. in my own crazy little head the other day on my way to work.. I saw 1 black woman with nice MBL hair out of may 75 to 80 women in NYC. Most of the hair I saw was chewed up and spit out and damaged or just in short cuts, maybe by choice but I dont believe that.. Black women ( who have not found LHCF) begin to think they can not grow their hair long and its just impossible.. And most believe its because of genetics.. IMO

 

[AvaSpeaks]

Too many Saturdays in the salon getting that fly cut.

When I was in high school, lots of sistas would get the fly cuts because their hair was "not growing".

yes we were getting the fly cuts, but I still graduated with plenty of neck-length girls in high school. I mean in 4 years, there was hardly any change.

 

[tocktick]

I notice a few people are mentioning things like, "my X race friend sleeps rough", "she's Y race does 123 thing that I can't do" etc but what does that have to do with the rate at which one's hair grows? Imo, unless they are doing something that directly affects their scalp then what one does to their strands externally will not affect your growth.

Many women here arrive having been something like SL their whole life because what they are doing externally is wrong, with the right practices they often surpass that length.

 

[MrsHdrLe]

I haven't seen very many African (born/bred and living in the continent) women/girls with long hair (past apl) for the same reason most of us here say our hair gets to a "certain length and breaks off, that being between shoulder and apl. I think it has to do with diet and the practicality of maintaining long hair (moisture/conditioning). In fact, it seems most seem to prefer twa's so they don't have to be bothered.
(Please feel free to correct me. I'm just going on my own experiences.)

It may be different in other 3rd world types of countries. Granted our hair grows (anyone's does), but why then is it such an anomaly to see long hair on kinky textured black women? (One lady said it perfect when she said as a reason not to share HHG practices with others, "I'm selfish" that statement implies that it's not common and the fact that we even have this whole site/community proves it even more. What are we "drooling" (my self included) for then? Having long type 4b hair is an accomplishment. It doesn't just happen unless you're dreading. I can admit that.

I think the point is don't pretend that it's all the same and fair when it actually is not. People with 1-3 somthing hair have a different experience with growing their hair out. The 4s have to work at it a little more.