• We will be performing necessary maintenance on the forum and related hardware from Satuday 25th of September onward. Users might experience some downtime, which we will ensure that it is limited - if at all noticeable.

Man Shoots a Father During a Custody Dispute

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
That's sad. He killed him because he wanted to. Unless the dad was beating the mom, Kyle could of, when he went inside, he could of called the police and waited.
The dad, Chad was unarmed.
I see the debate is, well he tried to take his gun
He wouldn't of had to if he would of left the gun inside. I don't see how people shouldn't defend themselves when someone comes out with a gun. Are you supposed to stand there and get shot?
That wasn't even his property. He was having an affair and shacking up with the mom of the kids. Chad had a court order to pick up his son at that time. Some affair having cheater shouldn't of asserted himself in that argument. Chad's threat to the mom was ill take yall to court. He didn't lay hands on her. His wife ( kyle) is a judge and had all the records sealed so we, the public, have no other information about what happened other than these released videos.
Then after he shot him, nobody tried to render aid they just stood there arguing. Kyle pulled a Travis McMichael and said that's the last thing he wanted to do. Yeah, ok.
Sad, cold world we live in.
Maybe once more info comes out I'll have a different opinion but this doesn't look justified. They're saying under Texas law it was. I dunno..

After watching the Daniel Hambrick case, Ahmaud's murder and now this maybe I need to take a break from law and order for a while. It's just too easy now to kill someone for stupid reasons.
To me that was not justified. He could of stayed in the house.
 

dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
Um the man that was shot was in the wrong. He was right about taking them to court but he was wrong when he didn't retreat when someone has a gun and wrong to grab the gun (and missed!!!) Therefore he got shot. If you are bold enough to try to take someone's gun from them (on their property) then please be successful at taking the gun or else you risk being shot and killed!! Like wtf. The man already fired a warning shot and Mr. Dad didn't retreat and still threatens to take the gun and attempts to but fails. :ohwell:

(everybody is saying the short guy is a punk for bringing out a gun.) well the punk obviously feared for his life because what other reason would you bring out a gun for a bigger man on your property that is coming to confront you? :scratchchin: Did you really think he was going to knuckle up with the bigger aggressive guy and risk getting beat down? :scratchchin:

If you bring out a gun then you better intend on using it or else.
The Shooting was justified but it didn't have to happen.

What's wrong with people not backing down when the other person has a gun? People really do think they are big and bad, immortal and they have a death wish, by keep calling the other's bluff that is holding the gun. :whyme::nono:
F around and find out.
 

B_Phlyy

Pineapple Eating Unicorn
That's sad. He killed him because he wanted to. Unless the dad was beating the mom, Kyle could of, when he went inside, he could of called the police and waited.
The dad, Chad was unarmed.
I see the debate is, well he tried to take his gun
He wouldn't of had to if he would of left the gun inside. I don't see how people shouldn't defend themselves when someone comes out with a gun. Are you supposed to stand there and get shot?
That wasn't even his property. He was having an affair and shacking up with the mom of the kids. Chad had a court order to pick up his son at that time. Some affair having cheater shouldn't of asserted himself in that argument. Chad's threat to the mom was ill take yall to court. He didn't lay hands on her. His wife ( kyle) is a judge and had all the records sealed so we, the public, have no other information about what happened other than these released videos.
Then after he shot him, nobody tried to render aid they just stood there arguing. Kyle pulled a Travis McMichael and said that's the last thing he wanted to do. Yeah, ok.
Sad, cold world we live in.
Maybe once more info comes out I'll have a different opinion but this doesn't look justified. They're saying under Texas law it was. I dunno..

After watching the Daniel Hambrick case, Ahmaud's murder and now this maybe I need to take a break from law and order for a while. It's just too easy now to kill someone for stupid reasons.
To me that was not justified. He could of stayed in the house.

Even though some of the records are now sealed, it sounds like Kyle (the shooter) was/is married to the mom. So yes, he did have reason to assert himself since Chad was threatening his spouse on their property.

As Chad had a scheduled court order to pick up the son, once he saw the mom wasn't complying, he should have called the police for assistance. Maybe because she's a judge he thought she would try something, but still, he shouldn't have escalated it. No, that's not justification for his killing, but there were several times before the fatal shot came where he could have walked away without harm.
 

PatDM'T

Well-Known Member
Um the man that was shot was in the wrong. He was right about taking them to court but he was wrong when he didn't retreat when someone has a gun and wrong to grab the gun (and missed!!!) Therefore he got shot. If you are bold enough to try to take someone's gun from them (on their property) then please be successful at taking the gun or else you risk being shot and killed!! Like wtf. The man already fired a warning shot and Mr. Dad didn't retreat and still threatens to take the gun and attempts to but fails. :ohwell:

(everybody is saying the short guy is a punk for bringing out a gun.) well the punk obviously feared for his life because what other reason would you bring out a gun for a bigger man on your property that is coming to confront you? :scratchchin: Did you really think he was going to knuckle up with the bigger aggressive guy and risk getting beat down? :scratchchin:

If you bring out a gun then you better intend on using it or else.
The Shooting was justified but it didn't have to happen.

What's wrong with people not backing down when the other person has a gun? People really do think they are big and bad, immortal and they have a death wish, by keep calling the other's bluff that is holding the gun. :whyme::nono:
F around and find out.

I also do not
understand why
people do not
respect weapons
and just walk away.
 

Kanky

Well-Known Member
Trashy people. And obviously he should not have brought that gun out. There is no scenario where pointing a gun at the father over a custody dispute was going to end well. Even if the father had just left and called the police this still wouldn’t have looked good in family court and might’ve cost the mother custody. Now either the mother’s new marriage is over or her relationship with her children is over. Probably both. Her hot headed fool of a new husband has ruined her life and her kid’s lives.
 

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
Even though some of the records are now sealed, it sounds like Kyle (the shooter) was/is married to the mom. So yes, he did have reason to assert himself since Chad was threatening his spouse on their property.

As Chad had a scheduled court order to pick up the son, once he saw the mom wasn't complying, he should have called the police for assistance. Maybe because she's a judge he thought she would try something, but still, he shouldn't have escalated it. No, that's not justification for his killing, but there were several times before the fatal shot came where he could have walked
Kyle is not married to the mom ( Christine). Kyle is the ex husband of the judge ( Ann Marie). Kyle was having an affair with Christine. Their ( Kyle and Ann Marie) divorce was not final until 2 weeks AFTER the shooting. Technically he was still married to Ann Marie. The Mom ( Christine) is NOT the judge.
Chad threatened her with going to court no hitting her, threatening to hit her. It was court ordered to pick up his son at 3:15...Christine was purposely hiding him.
My feelings are still that killing Chad over a custody issue is not justified. Chad had the right to be there to pick up his son and the mom didn't have the child there because "she wanted to see her son."
I hate how shooting people over nothing is normalized. I guess I'll just be dead because if someone comes at me with a gun I'm not standing there to get shot. Fight or Flight. Get shot running or try to fight for your life.
Why get the gun if you don't intend to shoot? and he's supposed to just stand there and get shot? That makes no sense to me.
 
Last edited:

PatDM'T

Well-Known Member
Kyle is not married to the mom ( Christine). Kyle is the ex husband of the judge ( Ann Marie). Kyle was having an affair with Christine. Their ( Kyle and Ann Marie) divorce was not final until 2 weeks AFTER the shooting. Technically he was still married to Ann Marie. The Mom ( Christine) is NOT the judge.
Chad threatened her with going to court no hitting her, threatening to hit her. It was court ordered to pick up his son at 3:15...Christine was purposely hiding him.
My feelings are still that killing Chad over a custody issue is not justified. Chad had the right to be there to pick up his son and the mom didn't have the child there because "she wanted to see her son."

The whole mess
is senseless.
Why was Christine
not honoring a
court order?
All that drama
and for what?
How does Christine
feel now?

I hate how shooting people over nothing is normalized. I guess I'll just be dead because if someone comes at me with a gun I'm not standing there to get shot. Fight or Flight. Get shot running or try to fight for your life.
Why get the gun if you don't intend to shoot? and he's supposed to just stand there and get shot? That makes no sense to me.

I agree with
fight or flight.

If I can get away
I am going to
walk away.

The only time
it makes sense
to me to fight
with someone armed
with a gun is
if you are
cornered and
the one wielding
the gun is not
giving you an
option to retreat.

That was not
the case here.
Chad was asked
to leave but
chose not to.
Now Kyle is a punk
for getting the
gun and that
action did indeed
make things worse,
as he could have
called cops instead.

But once the gun
was at play,
the minute Chad
threatened to use
it on Kyle
he was treading
on thin ice.
When he then
grabbed it after
that threat, then
he didn't just have
the castle law
working against him,
IMO, but also the
self defense one.
 

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
The whole mess
is senseless.
Why was Christine
not honoring a
court order?
All that drama
and for what?
How does Christine
feel now?



I agree with
fight or flight.

If I can get away
I am going to
walk away.

The only time
it makes sense
to me to fight
with someone armed
with a gun is
if you are
cornered and
the one wielding
the gun is not
giving you an
option to retreat.

That was not
the case here.
Chad was asked
to leave but
chose not to.
Now Kyle is a punk
for getting the
gun and that
action did indeed
make things worse,
as he could have
called cops instead.

But once the gun
was at play,
the minute Chad
threatened to use
it on Kyle
he was treading
on thin ice.
When he then
grabbed it after
that threat, then
he didn't just have
the castle law
working against him,
IMO, but also the
self defense one.
Yes I understand what you're saving however when does someone without a gun have the right to defend themselves against someone with a gun?

Seems like Ahmaud Arbery then had no rights to defend himself against a shotgun just because the McMichaels brought it to the party and told him to stop.

More times than not a person with a gun isn't just going to let you walk away.

But I digress. If this is justified then there's going to be a lot of dead people over custody issues. No you can't see you kid. I gotta gun. leave or ill shoot you for rightfully coming to get your kid.


If all you gotta do is escalate the issue by going to get your gun and then claim self defense when you kill someone it's gonna be a lot of dead folks getting away with murder. ie the Trayvon Martin type cases.

A lot of people were upset over Rittenhouse being acquitted and he had a gun. What makes his case different when he was threatened by all three victims and killed two of them ( for people upset at him being aquitted).
 

Iwander

Well-Known Member
Kyle is not married to the mom ( Christine). Kyle is the ex husband of the judge ( Ann Marie). Kyle was having an affair with Christine. Their ( Kyle and Ann Marie) divorce was not final until 2 weeks AFTER the shooting. Technically he was still married to Ann Marie. The Mom ( Christine) is NOT the judge.
Chad threatened her with going to court no hitting her, threatening to hit her. It was court ordered to pick up his son at 3:15...Christine was purposely hiding him.
My feelings are still that killing Chad over a custody issue is not justified. Chad had the right to be there to pick up his son and the mom didn't have the child there because "she wanted to see her son."
I hate how shooting people over nothing is normalized. I guess I'll just be dead because if someone comes at me with a gun I'm not standing there to get shot. Fight or Flight. Get shot running or try to fight for your life.
Why get the gun if you don't intend to shoot? and he's supposed to just stand there and get shot? That makes no sense to me.
I agree. That was not his property it was Christine's.
The whole thing could of been avoided.
In my opinion Kyle was wrong for bringing a gun to a verbal argument in which the mom was wrong for not having the kid there when the dad was supposed to get him.

I'm looking at this picture. Would I just walk away? I don't know that I'd be thinking he's just going to let me walk.

Screenshot_20211129-175123_YouTube.jpg
 

Crackers Phinn

Either A Blessing Or A Lesson.
ok, for people like me who aren't able to watch people get murdered in real time, here's the article. This was all some easily prevented nonsense. I'm really trying to figure out what is in the water, coffee or soft drinks that is making people think guns are for play play when they are pointed at them.

Nate Chute, Lubbock Avalanche-Journal
Fri, November 26, 2021, 6:10 PM·5 min read

Chad Read, a 54-year-old Lubbock father, was fatally shot in South Lubbock outside his ex-wife's house after a confrontation between the former couple and the woman's boyfriend on Nov. 5.
Court records identified William Kyle Carruth as the man suspected of shooting Read. The affidavit was signed by Judge Anne-Marie Carruth, who filed the document in a counter suit in her divorce from Kyle Carruth.
As of this writing, no charges have been filed in the case. Here's what we know about the case and those involved:

Christina Read and Chad Read argument tied child custody​

Video released by Jennifer Read, the current wife of Chad Read, showed Chad arguing with his ex-wife, Christina Read, over not having one of the former couple's sons available at a court ordered time.
During the argument, Christina could be heard saying the child was not home and that she was going to fetch him. She also said that she didn't abide by the court ordered deadline because she wanted to see their son.
"I don't care if you wanted to see him or not," Chad Read said. "I get him at 3:15 p.m. If you want to see him, you see him up until 3:15. You keep trying to keep my son from me."
Chad Read threatened to subpoena multiple people in response, including Kyle Carruth's ex wife, Judge Anne-Marie Carruth. At that point, Kyle, who previously told Chad to leave the property, emerged from the home with a rifle.

Chad Read and Kyle Carruth argued, struggled over gun​

The two can be seen bumping chests as they argue. Chad Read challenged Kyle Carruth to use the weapon.
"Do it," Read can be heard saying. "You better ******* use it ************."
The two continue arguing. Jennifer Read, who is filming the altercation from a vehicle, tells someone off camera to call the police. Carruth is seen firing a shot on the ground at Read's feet.
Read places his hand on the gun, propelling Carruth away from him. Carruth then spins around and fires twice at Read, who could be heard saying, "think I'm ******* scared?"
Video of the Nov. 5 shooting death of Chad Read was released Wednesday by Jennifer Read, who is now seeking custody of her husband's children.

Video of the Nov. 5 shooting death of Chad Read was released Wednesday by Jennifer Read, who is now seeking custody of her husband's children.
The camera pans at Read who has dropped on the ground as Jennifer Read calls again for someone to call 911.
Jennifer tells Kyle she has the incident on video.
"You did it, not him," Jennifer Read says.
Kyle responds, telling her "I told all of y'all to leave."
"None of you all should be here. I asked you to leave. I did everything ... I did not want to do any of this."
Responding officers arrived to find Chad dead at the scene.

Chad Read's obituary reveals recent marriage to Jennifer Read​

An obituary for Chad Read indicated that he "married the love his life" Jennifer Read on Sept. 4, 2021.
Chad Read was a Lubbock native who graduated from lewisville High School in 1985. The obituary says he was "a true entrepreneur in every sense of the word" and that he returned to Lubbock to raise a family in 2000. The obituary made no mention of his ex-wife Christina Read but indicated he had three children.
A funeral for Read took place on Nov. 12.

Anne-Marie Carruth married Kyle Carruth in 2008, divorced him in 2021​

Court filings show that the couple married in September 2009. They separated in July 2021 and Kyle Carruth filed for divorce in September. Their divorce was finalized two weeks after the shooting.
The affidavit, filed on Nov. 8, was filed as part of Anne-Marie Carruth's counter suit in the couple's divorce. According to the counter petition, Anne-Marie, a district court judge, was asking the court to exclude her ex-husband from their 9th Street home.
Ann-Marie Carruth

Ann-Marie Carruth
Gov. Greg Abbott appointed Anne-Marie Carruth judge of the 72nd Judicial District Court in Crosby and Lubbock Counties in January 2021 to take over the seat for a term set to expire at the end of 2022.
She stated in the affidavit that she hadn't spoken to Kyle about the shooting but said she was "very concerned about his mental state."
Lubbock County District Attorney Sunshine Stanek filed a motion with the AG's office recusing her office from the case, stating the "suspect is related to a Lubbock County elected official, who is also a potential witness."

Jennifer Read files petition for children; Kyle Carruth's lawyers say shooting was 'self defense'​

Through an attorney, Jennifer Read filed a petition alleging that Christina Read has endangered the well-being of two children by allowing them to be in the presence of Kyle Carruth.
"The children are aware that Kyle Carruth shot and killed their father in front of their mother, step-brother, and myself," Read's affidavit states. "Christina's decision to allow either of these children to be in Kyle Carruth's presence has caused, and continues to cause, significant impairment of their emotional well-being. The oldest child has expressed to me that he blames his mother for the shooting, and that he will run away from home if he sees Kyle there again."
Carruth’s attorney, David M. Guinn with Hurley, Guinn & Singh, has argued that the shooting was self-defense.
“All Texans may lawfully brandish a firearm to protect themselves, their property and their business.” Guinn said.
Guinn told EverythingLubbock.com that Read threatened to take the gun from Carruth. He also said the manner in which Carruth advanced towards him poised "an immediate threat" to his client.
“This is a justifiable homicide," Guinn contended.

Texas Attorney General reviewing shooting​

The Texas Attorney General's Office is reviewing the shooting after Lubbock police officials turned over their files on their investigation.
As of this writing, no charges have been filed in the case.
This article originally appeared on Lubbock Avalanche-Journal: Chad Read Lubbock shooting and Kyle Carruth: What we know
https://www.lubbockonline.com/story...-lubbock-judge-case-investigation/8765295002/
 

B_Phlyy

Pineapple Eating Unicorn
Kyle is not married to the mom ( Christine). Kyle is the ex husband of the judge ( Ann Marie). Kyle was having an affair with Christine. Their ( Kyle and Ann Marie) divorce was not final until 2 weeks AFTER the shooting. Technically he was still married to Ann Marie. The Mom ( Christine) is NOT the judge.
Chad threatened her with going to court no hitting her, threatening to hit her. It was court ordered to pick up his son at 3:15...Christine was purposely hiding him.
My feelings are still that killing Chad over a custody issue is not justified. Chad had the right to be there to pick up his son and the mom didn't have the child there because "she wanted to see her son."
I hate how shooting people over nothing is normalized. I guess I'll just be dead because if someone comes at me with a gun I'm not standing there to get shot. Fight or Flight. Get shot running or try to fight for your life.
Why get the gun if you don't intend to shoot? and he's supposed to just stand there and get shot? That makes no sense to me.


I was watching the video on 2x speed at work so got the names and relationships mixed up.

I doubt anyone is approving people being killed for nothing. Or trying to deny another parents rights to court appointed visitation time. However, once it became apparent mom wasn't going to produce the child at that moment and the gun showed up, Chad should have went back to his car and called the police and his lawyer.

Was Kyle a cowardly punk for bringing the gun to a shouting match? Yes.
Was Chad a big dummy for getting in his face and trying to grab the gun after a warning shot? Also yes.

Only Kyle knows the exact reason he brought the gun out but there was more than ample opportunity for Chad to walk away unscathed.
 

dancinstallion

Well-Known Member
Yes I understand what you're saving however when does someone without a gun have the right to defend themselves against someone with a gun?

Seems like Ahmaud Arbery then had no rights to defend himself against a shotgun just because the McMichaels brought it to the party and told him to stop.

More times than not a person with a gun isn't just going to let you walk away.

But I digress. If this is justified then there's going to be a lot of dead people over custody issues. No you can't see you kid. I gotta gun. leave or ill shoot you for rightfully coming to get your kid.


If all you gotta do is escalate the issue by going to get your gun and then claim self defense when you kill someone it's gonna be a lot of dead folks getting away with murder. ie the Trayvon Martin type cases.

A lot of people were upset over Rittenhouse being acquitted and he had a gun. What makes his case different when he was threatened by all three victims and killed two of them ( for people upset at him being aquitted).

It is no different but what makes it worst is
that he was on someone else's property!!!!!! You can NOT come on someone's else's property and demand anything and get in thier face when they don't give you what you are demanding even if it is yours. That is how people get caught up and jailed (OJ) or killed..

This is different from someone coming and chasing you with a gun. The guy fired a warning shot into the ground so he wanted him to walk away. But instead of walking/running away he got in the guys face even more and grabbed the gun. Well that is a chance he took and lost his life. Now he will never see his kid again.

Man listen, I ain't fighting or arguing with No one that's pointing a gun at me over a missed parent visitation. I will take their behinds to court and see that kid during my next visitation. Period.
 

naturalgyrl5199

Well-Known Member
Kyle is not married to the mom ( Christine). Kyle is the ex husband of the judge ( Ann Marie). Kyle was having an affair with Christine. Their ( Kyle and Ann Marie) divorce was not final until 2 weeks AFTER the shooting. Technically he was still married to Ann Marie. The Mom ( Christine) is NOT the judge.
Chad threatened her with going to court no hitting her, threatening to hit her. It was court ordered to pick up his son at 3:15...Christine was purposely hiding him.
My feelings are still that killing Chad over a custody issue is not justified. Chad had the right to be there to pick up his son and the mom didn't have the child there because "she wanted to see her son."
I hate how shooting people over nothing is normalized. I guess I'll just be dead because if someone comes at me with a gun I'm not standing there to get shot. Fight or Flight. Get shot running or try to fight for your life.
Why get the gun if you don't intend to shoot? and he's supposed to just stand there and get shot? That makes no sense to me.
I'm old school. People cannot fight. And I'm not gonna stand there and just watch you kill me. I'm gonna react. They said the same thing about Ahmaud Aubrey. They were legit mad he went for the gun to disarm them rather than let them shoot him. "Oh here is your gun...please here is my open chest for you to put 2 hot ones in!" I don't understand this logic...other than the shooter just mad when they brandished, the victim didn't shake in their boots. Thus proving the point some people brandish for clout trying to scare people. That's not even steeped in reality.

On the other hand...to shoot this man who had a legal right to be there is wrong. Period.

So the end result, the biological father is dead at the hands of his stepfather or whatever. The child they were hiding is gonna hate the mother and step father forever. I see no winners. Kyle killed his prey and SHOULD sit in jail. Now what? You're a murderer. Congratulations. Don't drop the soap if you're convicted.
 

naturalgyrl5199

Well-Known Member
For me---these yt folk can sort themselves out. They barely extend the same rights to protect oneself to us to the fullest extent. A man is dead and not one charge had been filed. Both men are stupid. They played a stupid game measuring their "member" against each other like recalcitrant jealous teenagers. Kyle might not be "scared" but he is a murderer forever. And no one's life was in danger. He wasn't defending his lover or a child in danger. He brought it to brandish (and yes its legal but everything legal isn't prudent). No one was in harms way. He just wanted Chad off the porch at the end of the day. He prolly got mad cause Chad brought up his wife who was trying to divorce him and cut him out of a marital asset. I can't stand men sometimes.
Corrected for typo.
 
Last edited:

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
It is no different but what makes it worst is
that he was on someone else's property!!!!!! You can NOT come on someone's else's property and demand anything and get in thier face when they don't give you what you are demanding even if it is yours. That is how people get caught up and jailed (OJ) or killed..

This is different from someone coming and chasing you with a gun. The guy fired a warning shot into the ground so he wanted him to walk away. But instead of walking/running away he got in the guys face even more and grabbed the gun. Well that is a chance he took and lost his life. Now he will never see his kid again.

Man listen, I ain't fighting or arguing with No one that's pointing a gun at me over a missed parent visitation. I will take their behinds to court and see that kid during my next visitation. Period.
I respect your perspective.

Many moons ago my husband got shot in the foot after some fool pulled a gun on him. The altercation between them was because my husband accidentally spilled a drink on his shoes when they bumped into each other. He said he immediately apologized but when he left the club that guy was outside and approached him. At the time he was with his late wife.
His choices were to stand there and get shot, try to talk Jim down and back away, or fight.
He chose to fight.
Although he got shot with them wrestling over the gun, he is alive today. Had he tried to back away he thinks that fool would of shot him and his wife.
Now, his military training helped him in this situation so that was a huge factor in him deciding to fight besides the fact he didn't want his wife to get hurt.
We've talked alot about guns and what to do.
I can't say for sure that I'd not freeze up and do nothing but in my head I'm gonna do what I can to survive.
This case was just sad and unnecessary. A whole life taken over a custody argument.

And what does Christine do now? Stay shacked up with the man who was having an affair on his wife? The same man that killed you ex husband and the father of your child that you purposely kept hiding?

It is tragic to me.
 

PatDM'T

Well-Known Member
I respect your perspective.

Many moons ago my husband got shot in the foot after some fool pulled a gun on him. The altercation between them was because my husband accidentally spilled a drink on his shoes when they bumped into each other. He said he immediately apologized but when he left the club that guy was outside and approached him. At the time he was with his late wife.
His choices were to stand there and get shot, try to talk Jim down and back away, or fight.
He chose to fight.
Although he got shot with them wrestling over the gun, he is alive today. Had he tried to back away he thinks that fool would of shot him and his wife.
Now, his military training helped him in this situation so that was a huge factor in him deciding to fight besides the fact he didn't want his wife to get hurt.
We've talked alot about guns and what to do.
I can't say for sure that I'd not freeze up and do nothing but in my head I'm gonna do what I can to survive.
This case was just sad and unnecessary. A whole life taken over a custody argument.

And what does Christine do now? Stay shacked up with the man who was having an affair on his wife? The same man that killed you ex husband and the father of your child that you purposely kept hiding?

It is tragic to me.

@Jmartjrmd
I enjoy discussions
involving the law
and always appreciate
your input on them.

I had wondered
if castle law
would work in
Kyle's favor but
then someone said
he was not
inside his castle.
Also as you
pointed out,
by going to
get the gun, he
became the aggressor.
So it would
seem as if he
cannot use the
self-defense argument.

Furthermore, Chad
was only guilty
of trespassing since
he was asked to
leave but did not.

Texas Penal Code Section 9.41 explains that a person is allowed to use force, but not deadly force, to terminate a mere trespass or interference with property.

  • “Trespass” occurs when a person enters onto or into property, knowing that entry is forbidden or remains on the property after being told to leave by someone with authority.
So, when can you use deadly force in Texas to protect property? Texas law allows you to use deadly force to protect property if you would be justified in using force, and you reasonably believe it is immediately necessary to prevent the imminent commission of specific enumerated property crimes. These are arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime.
More on this here.

So from that
it would indeed
seem as if
Kyle might
be in trouble
for using deadly
force as he
could have called
the police about
the trespassing.

But was Kyle
really wrong to
go for the gun?

Since Chad was
trespassing, Kyle
had a right to
use force to
get him out.
So brandishing
a gun was his
way of using force
(cuz maybe he
knew he could
not fight him)
Another use of
force was firing
a warning shot.

Where use of
deadly force came
into play was
when Chad grabbed
the gun after
he had said he
would use it
to kill Kyle.

It is reasonable
that in the
beginning Kyle feared
the situation might
turn violent and
that Chad could
harm him or
Christine and the
only way he
saw to deal
with someone bigger
than him was
to scare him
off with a gun.
And so he
went to fetch it.

Kyle did not
shoot Chad when
he said he would
kill him with
his own gun,
which may be
considered restraint
on Kyle's part.

Kyle shot Chad
after Chad grabbed
for his gun
to supposedly follow
through with his threat.

Which is why
self-defense may
work in Kyle's favor
cuz there was
the threat then
the action toward
fulfilling that threat
= imminent danger.

In the case
of your hubby
or Ahmaud, they
were "standing
their ground".
They both had
a right to use
force in self-defense
because in both cases,
Aggressor(s) confronted
them and it was
reasonable to assume
they were facing
imminent danger
and were each
in a fight
for their lives.
 
Last edited:

LivingInPeace

Well-Known Member
White folks love the idea of being in the Wild Wild West. This was some foolishness. I don't understand how you have a right to kill someone who is outside of your house. The man was able to reenter the house and retrieve a rifle and go back outside. If his life was in jeopardy he could have stayed inside and called the police. But these are the rules white folks want; Start a problem; agitate the other person into aggression; then kill them and claim you're the victim.
 

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
White folks love the idea of being in the Wild Wild West. This was some foolishness. I don't understand how you have a right to kill someone who is outside of your house. The man was able to reenter the house and retrieve a rifle and go back outside. If his life was in jeopardy he could have stayed inside and called the police. But these are the rules white folks want; Start a problem; agitate the other person into aggression; then kill them and claim you're the victim.
This is exactly how I feel.
He had options other than what he did.
I read they had alot of prior run ins with each other in which Chad wished ill will on Kyle so I'm sure if he gets charged he will probably walk.
It was a lot of bad blood from Christine keeping their son from him whereas he had court ordered visitation.
I have to read up on Texas new gun laws but Texans love their guns and the right to shoot.
Besides that his ex is a judge so I can see some corruption going on even though the first DA's office recused themselves.
I watched a YouTube video where someone in the court system said if Kyle can get this treatment everyone should be entitled to this treatment
 

Jmartjrmd

Well-Known Member
@Jmartjrmd
I enjoy discussions
involving the law
and always appreciate
your input on them.

I had wondered
if castle law
would work in
Kyle's favor but
then someone said
he was not
inside his castle.
Also as you
pointed out,
by going to
get the gun, he
became the aggressor.
So it would
seem that if he
cannot use the
self-defense argument.

Furthermore, Chad
was only guilty
of trespassing since
he was asked to
leave but did not.



More on this here.

So from that
it would indeed
seem as if
Kyle might
be in trouble
for using deadly
force as he
could have called
the police about
the trespassing.

But was Kyle
really wrong to
go for the gun?

Since Chad was
trespassing, Kyle
had a right to
use force to
get him out.
So brandishing
a gun was his
way of using force
(cuz maybe he
knew he could
not fight him)
Another use of
force was firing
a warning shot.

Where use of
deadly force came
into play was
when Chad grabbed
the gun after
he had said he
would use it
to kill Kyle.

It is reasonable
that in the
beginning Kyle feared
the situation might
turn violent and
that Chad could
harm him or
Christine and the
only way he
saw to deal
with someone bigger
than him was
to scare him
off with a gun.
And so he
went to fetch it.

Kyle did not
shoot Chad when
he said he would
kill him with
his own gun,
which may be
considered restraint
in Kyle's part.

Kyle shot Chad
after Chad grabbed
for his gun
to supposedly follow
through with his threat.

Which is why
self-defense may
work in Kyle's favor
cuz there was
the threat then
the action toward
fulfilling that threat
= imminent danger.

In the case
of your hubby
or Ahmaud, they
were "standing
their ground".
They both had
a right to use
force in self-defense
because in both cases,
Aggressor(s) confronted
them and it was
reasonable to assume
they were facing
imminent danger
and were each
in a fight
for their lives.
I can see a case for both sides. I'm not a lawyer ( though I play one while watching court TV) so a lot of times my opinion doesn't align with the way laws are written.
I enjoy watching the cases. The fun in it is everyone has differing views.
Yes my husband really had no choice if he wanted to live and protect his wife. I only gave that example thinking about myself. I watch too much of the first 48 and forensic files to say I'd not try and prevent someone from shooting me if I can. It's just so easy for people to do and if I had to choose between standing there and getting shot and trying yo save my life, I'm going to try and save my life. I would back away if that was a clear option.
More times than not if they pull a gun on you they are going to shoot. At least around these parts they do. This used to be a safe area I felt comfortable raising our kids in but everybody here has a shoot first mentality.

On another note there was another deadly school shooting today
Sad cold world.
 

yamilee21

Well-Known Member
There seems to be an issue with white men named Kyle. I suggest that we arrest all of the Kyles until we figure out what is going on.
All the white Kyles except Kyle Mooney from SNL. :giggle:
Seriously, I would really like to hear a media pundit use your exact line on some news shows. :lol:
 

fluffyforever

Well-Known Member
One of the first things taught when handling a gun- If you show up brandishing a weapon, you better be prepared to use it. He lived that principle exactly as he was taught and had no qualms about it as a proud Texan. He showed he was about that life when he racked the gun and then again when fired a warning shot.

As for the father, he should have just let it go and called the police, and then follow through on the threat to take them to court. But hindsight is always 20/20.

It must be hard to think clearly under rage stemming from a missing son he’s there to pick up, plus the fact that he is dealing with a boyfriend of his ex who has nothing to do with the custody issue. Then when the boyfriend returns after pulling out the gun, the man’s ego wasn’t going to let him be ran off like a little punk. So he squares up to the boyfriend proving how he is literally is the bigger man, causing them to stare each other down like they are shooting a promo card for a boxing match. When the boyfriend shoots a shot at his feet, we can tell it’s not going to end well.

real question is, whose gun was that, did the boyfriend keep his gun at the mothers house or did the mother give the boyfriend her gun to run off the father?
 
Top