Question for those folks with 3b or 3c hair

[iris]

Armyqt said:
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
One thing that concerned me, was that the use of henna over time, builds up on the hair cuticle and seals it, which prevents moisture from going in . This causes cause the hair to become extremely dry and easy to break. Can you tell me how do you counteract this effect. Do you think it's safe for me to use on my 6yr old's hair? Thanks in advance.

[/ QUOTE ]

For some reason, I am not worried about dryness and breakage overtime using the henna. I don't know who it was that said their friend used henna and grew waistelength hair! Then another person said they used the Hask's henna and placenta and it changed their hairtexture aside from growing their hair /images/graemlins/shocked.gif I have to run a search because I'm positive that I read it on this hairforum. Now if henna applied over an extensive period of time breaks hair, how in the world was someone able to grow their hair waistelength using it? It's just like Tracy using the Fantasia line. That line acts just like henna in that it seals the hairs cuticle. That stuff seals your cuticles also, but look at her Tracy's hair! All long, thicker, shining, gleaming!

I feel as long as you add oils/nutrients/conditioner to the mix, anyone should do A-ok using it!

hth,
Iris

 

[Mahalialee4]

TO ADD TO MY DAILY ROUTINE: I use my homemade Daily Moisturizer combo: I make a batch of moisturizer that should last me 2-3 weeks. about 1 tbls Emu oil; 1 tbl. castor oil; 1 tsp Extra Virgin Olive Oil; 2 tbls natural glycerine; and then I add leave in conditioner to the mixture: My preference is Mane and Tail Straight Arrow Hoof Moisture that I buy from Eqyss Products: (1 tbl.) and Infusium restructurizing lotion leave in conditioner (1 tbl). I shake this mixture up in a bottle until it is creamy thick and oh so moisturizing. Anyway. I just smooth this into my hair once a day and twist it up into two buns and I am good to go. I do not get buildup and my hair after the initial comb out stays smooth and straight. After my shampoo, AVC, deepcondtioning, Infusium leave in: I always add tiny bit of olive oil to my hair before my comb out. (Eliminates breakage for me.)Then I add my moisturizer.Hope this works for somebody else. Bonjour. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[kasey]

Mahalialee,

Thanks for the moisturizer recipe.

Yesterday I visited the herb shop where the Baka is sold. The shopkeeper tried to call the company to find out about the product, but she got no answer. I was considering trying the product until I found out that it costs $10 for what looks like a one ounce package. I also saw the sahara clay which looks kind of interesting, but I didn't get that either.

But I did get some more henna. This herb shop sells it in bulk for $1.50 an ounce. I am satisfied with the effects of henna and am not interested in the Baka, especially if it is made with a poisonous herb.

 

[CynamonKis]

Re: WARNING: BE CAUTIOUS RE: Baka Beautiful Natural-la

What I discovered about Bodiphier is that it is not "natural" as advertised and when I used a semi-permanent color after applying it, the combination took my hair out, I had shoulder-length hair &amp; now I am fighting to keep what little I have left....

 

[Mahalialee4]

RELAXER DAMAGE????

If you have damage, I would suggest that you give your hair and scalp some Vitamin C and E. Here is a site that gives you some information on the benefit. http://www.ecmode.com/Whatyourdoct.html#anchor219330
I do not have a relaxer, but about 2x a year, I give my hair a bath with Vitamin C. crystals,( I use what I have on hand...I do not order from the company) plus aloe vera and follow up with a Vit. E. Scalp Treatment. This really seems to tone and condition my SCALP. Geat scalp detoxifier. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Bonjour.

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
One thing that concerned me, was that the use of henna over time, builds up on the hair cuticle and seals it, which prevents moisture from going in . This causes cause the hair to become extremely dry and easy to break

[/ QUOTE ]

Iris and ArmyQT This concerns me as well. I would love to try Henna but I have heard way too many negative things concerning henna. One of them being how henna reacts with permanent color if you have it in your hair or if you ever plan to apply color to your hair. You will have to grow out the henna-ed hair or grow out the color from your hair.
I have also heard how it can react with certain hair products and the chemicals in them.
Like Mahaliale uses many different natural mixtures and potions to combat the dryness but for someone like me I just don't have time to do all of that!!

And Iris keep in mind that just because someone used Henna and grew waistlength hair it may or may not work for everyone.
I also do not think (IMO) that products that seal the cuticle work the same way henna does. Cuticle sealing and buildup are too different things. Henna builds up and hardens on the cuticle sort of the way as when you use too much protein and this is what causes the dryness and brittleness b/c your hair cortex cannot receive moisture and even some conditioning treatments. But (from what I have read - Mahalialee correct me if I am wrong ) Henna can not be washed off the way you can wash off too much product with a clarifying shampoo.
For some reason I remember typing this before....
So I think all prospective henna users should do their research, see if they will have the time to devote to giving the hair proper moisture and be willing to limit (or stop) the use of hair colors/dyes
For me personally I think I will pass. It just sounds too permanent and it's not 'exact' enough (if you know what I mean ) The results just seem way too unpredictable...green hair, waist length hair, brittle hair, silky hair...who knows what will happen.

Valleygirl

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
When you stop doing this treatment, your hair will just return to the regular texture

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this true Mahalialee? Not calling you a liar but I have always heard that the only way to remove the henna is to cut it off b/c it hardens onto the hair shaft.
I know you probably sai this before but how long have you been doing the henna treatments? Have you ever stopped long enough in between treatments to let your natural texture come back?
And lastly do you or Iris have any pics you can post? I would love to see some before or after henna pics. especially Iris since you said that your hair came out as straight as it was when it was relaxed.
TIA
Valleygirl

 

[hairfanatic]

WOW! /images/graemlins/shocked.gif Ladies, thank you so much for this WONDERFUL thread. I have definately learned a lot about Henna and was thinking about using it. This is DEFINATELY something I will try. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[CynamonKis]

Re: RELAXER DAMAGE????

No my scalp isn't damaged--just a portion of my hair in the back where I applied heat w/the Bodiphier, unfortunately where most of my hair length was. Suprisingly the rest of my hair is in very good condition.

 

[iris]

Valleygirl,

I had posted a thread regarding which henna I use if you had took the time to read it because all henna apparently is not the same. I can't speak on any other brand but the one I use. I use hennalucent and the package says: Hennalucent is the only professional henna product that penetrates the hairshaft through natural, organic absorption to deliver long-term shine, body and beautiful color highlights. <font color="blue">Only Hennalucent is totally compatible with all chemical services</font> BECAUSE IT DOES NOT COAT THE HAIR THE WAY OTHER HENNA PRODUCTS DO. Hennalucent is a unique formulation of micro-refined henna, hydrolyzed protein, pH neutralizers and rich, organic conditioners that revitalizes all types of hair. It repairs split ends, adds new strength and vitality. Even dry, damaged, chemically treated hair becomes healthier and more vibrant....

I had an adore haircolor and used the hennalucent on top of it with no problem. Nop, no raking and scrapping to get the henna out so the color could look natural here. And as for your comment about just because someone used Henna and grew waistlength hair it may or may not work for everyone. My response is if the girl who grew her hair waistelength had listened to people like you who said just because it did it for one doesn't mean the same will happen to you, where would that girl's hair be today in terms of length? How would she or for that matter any of us know unless we try? I posted a thread regarding henna and remember some time back there was a thread started by Kasey? or CiCi24 regarding henna. Obviously, those of us who use it have done our "research" not only on this forum but on the internet as well. If I can recall correctly I even think there was a debate over whether using the Fantasia cuticle sealing products were any good for a persons hair. In my honest opinion I think if there was a poster child for the effectiveness of it, Tracy would be it /images/graemlins/up.gif (Oh, by the way, in addition to using the henna, I use the Fantasia line as well /images/graemlins/wink.gif.) I believe there was even a thread over whether conditioner washes were any good for a persons hair. IMHO, whatever floats your boat.
Some liked, some didn't like. Life goes on /images/graemlins/smile.gif. As for the hennalucent, I do remember some others who have tried the product with no problem. Just because you or anyone else have a problem with it does not mean everyone will. Just like those who have found success with it doesn't necessarily mean everyone will. To each her own. Noone will ever know how effective a product will be unless they try it, because one man's or in this case, woman's trash, may be another woman's treasure /images/graemlins/wink.gif

I almost forgot. As for your request about posting a pic- sorry darling. I will not be posting a pic anytime soon /images/graemlins/Flahssssss.gif

Iris

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

Whoa Iris....dude what's wrong?

I was just asking a question and stating a few things regarding the henna. I am terribly sorry if you took my post the wrong way.

The info was not necessarialy for you,(b/c I did read that you did a henna treatment with good results last week) but more for someone else who maybe lurks on here or anyone who just reads the info and runs out and tries it w/o doing research.

I have been on hair boards a long time and have seen this happen a few times.

I am not trying to be negative and say don't try something. but I have read and heard several times how henna reacts with permanent hair color. I would hate for someone to come on here and read that henna can help your hair grow to waist length and that person has a permanent hair color then tries the henna and ends up with green hair.

I guess I missed that info regarding the Hennalucent (that it can be used with chemical services..) when I read the thread. My bad! But there are two different threads going on about henna right now.

So you see I didn't know that, I thought all henna was the same.

I know I posted a link about the negative effects of henna on the old board so I just wanted to give the info again.(I did not see any posts about how henna reacts with hair color or other hair products)

You ladies have had good results with Henna...I am happy. But at the same time I have heard horror stories. I am not saying 'do not try it' but I wanted to say be careful and do research on how it will react to YOUR hair (not 'your' hair Iris.)

And that's cool if you don't wish to post a pic. We are all on here to share and discuss hair advice and opinions and that is why I posted the previous info...that's all....I'm not trying to start any battles girl!!!

Valleygirl

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

Re: RELAXER DAMAGE????

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I had an adore haircolor and used the hennalucent on top of it with no problem

[/ QUOTE ]

Also just stating the facts Adore is a Semi-Permanent Haircolor which may (or may not) react with a henna treatment b/c Adore and most semi-permanents have no peroxide or ammonia where as permanent hair colors and dyes have peroxide and/or ammonia and sometimes other chemicals.
So if someones using hair dye uses Henna (besides Hennalucent) they may react negatively with one another.

This is not for you Iris b/c I am sure you have done your research so this is for anyone else who may not know. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Valleygirl

 

[pebbles]

Iris,

Valleygirl was stating her personal opinion. I don't think it was your intention for your response to come off so harsh, but it did. I do believe it's important for everyone to give their opinions for and against any product or technique. That way, the rest of us can decide whether we want to use it or not, based on the different reviews and opinions made by members.

Thanks /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Allandra]

ValleyGirl,

Well, I definitely appreciate your post on this thread. I also thought all henna was the same. I had only heard bad/negative things about henna as well. I'll just continue with my little rinses every now and then. No henna for me. /images/graemlins/nono.gif

Thanks for sharing this information. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[hada]

I would like to add that....ALWAYS DO A PATCHTEST FIRST!! That is what all henna companies say. And If a test patch is done, then there shouldn't be any problems and takes the guess work out of how one's hair would come out. I think you end of with weird colors such as green and orange on lighter colored hair. On darker hair, you can get away with it. My color is very dark with a tint of tranlucent cherry. Also the brand and how old the henna is can be factors into how the henna comes out in the hair. I do believe the henna begins to fade over time. My deep metallic red hairs (from my silver hairs) is starting to become more copper penny. I think if you allow enough time to go by the henna would eventually fade.
My hair is completely natural. I do have a bit of jet black color left on the ends, which shows no color change, and it is fine.

hada

 

[CynamonKis]

Mahalialee, where do you buy natural glycerine and sheep sorrel from?

 

[hairfanatic]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
ValleyGirl,

Well, I definitely appreciate your post on this thread. I also thought all henna was the same. I had only heard bad/negative things about henna as well. I'll just continue with my little rinses every now and then. No henna for me.

Thanks for sharing this information.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree Allandra,

I definately appreciated your response Valleygirl. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Sometimes it can be difficult to recommend products because everything is NOT going to work for everyone else but I do think it's important for everyone to show their experiences with a product because this is how we learn. Some things people will just have to try but for those that want to try a product also have to keep in mind that they are trying at their own risk.

Allandra, you also brought up a good point when you said that you were going to continue with your rinses because after hearing all of the pros and cons, you were able to make a decision and not stray away from what you know what works.

 

[sassygirl125]

Re: Lovely Secret!

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
If you don't feel like gathering all the ingredients buy the Gold Medal Herbal Tame at www.goldmedalhair.com for about $6 for a one ounce package.

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I'm confused... Gold Medal Herbal Tame is henna and alone it will loosen the curl? Or are you saying mix the Herbal Tame with some neutral henna powder and oils?
Thanks in advance!

 

[sassygirl125]

Re: Lovely Secret!

Another question--

Does the new growth have to be touched up like a relaxer or permanent color, or do you just apply the mixture to your entire head once a month?

 

[Mahalialee4]

Re: Lovely Secret!

A variety of responses to all: /images/graemlins/smile.gifYou can buy natural glycerine and sheep sorrel tincture at the health food store or a natural pharmacy.
/images/graemlins/smile.gifAs far as henna fading and texture returning: I have used henna in the past without adding conditioner and the henna faded out of my hair and my hair color and texture changed. By that I mean, with the henna my strands were thicker and stronger. That was over 2 years ago. That was part of the treatment to restore my fragile hair. I added oils, yogurt, and egg when I used it in the past. This was a moisturizing conditioner and did not dry out my hair, as I always followed it with a hot oil treatment, the Indian way. I was not using it to loosen my curl, just to strengthen the strands so it would stop breaking.
I do not use permanent or semi permanent color or relaxer on my hair so PERSONALLY FOR ME there is no problem with chemical reactions. As a licensed hair stylist, I am well aware of that problem. Actually when you relax and color, you are double processing your hair. If the color has ammonia,(bleach) or peroxide (bleach)(meaning it is a permanent color technically, and you are adding relaxer (chemical), and very unpredictable, this is permanent also:And it is like a box of chocolates....you cannot predict over time what relaxers, or permanent hair color will do to your hair because they are chemicals and they react differently under different circumstances and to confounding variables. Only time will tell. They both go into the hair shaft, and some have experienced great damage, while some claim great success. Personally, I feel that chemicals are like a time bomb for SOME people, because their particular hair cannot handle the chemicals. Some react to the chemicals. But "relaxing", that is a matter of choice again. In any case: You are using conditioners, hot oil treatments, etc. to combat dryness and keep your hair moisturized and conditioned. So personally, I do not feel that I am doing any extra work with my using a henna conditioner treatment /images/graemlins/wink.gif I just will use that once every three months now because it is straight enough. In the past when I used henna, I only did it every three months.Since henna gradually wears off, generally after three months...it is not cumulative in the way that you may think. Since then, I have over time gone long periods of time without using henna, and have seen my own natural texture, which is so soft, like cotton candy, (like a baby's) that you cannot do too much with because it floats and does not have enough weight. This is my personal experience of using and not using henna. I rarely lose any strands of hair. Maybe 2 strands in two weeks if I comb out properly. It is very thick, and easy to comb out. I use a very high quality of henna.(Persian). I wash my hair generally every 3 days, using Cathy Howse method and find that my hair behaves better after each time it is washed and deep conditioned with my homemade Cathy Howse conditioner and my coconut coconut conditioner. I oil my ends as needed with EVO :
The key point is that my initial response was for and to the lady who asked about loosening the curl on 3b-c hair. I prefer henna to a relaxer for obvious reasons. My hair strands are naturally fine and my hair is naturally curly and I do not want to use a chemical product. I would not have offered advice on relaxers. I prefer to leave that to those who use them, have had long time experience using them. To those who have had long time success, I think that is wonderful and never would I knock it because obviously it is working for them. I would like to add that I spend a lot of time researching and I am ALWAYS very open to learning from others and sharing my experience with products and techniques etc, (THE GOOD BAD AND THE UGLY! but I would never impose my choices on others. /images/graemlins/grin.gifI do not share with the intent or expectation that someone must try it or defend their reasons for not doing so. It's just a post. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif
I have done thorough research on henna IN THE PAST and will continue to do so. We have a large Indian community here, and I have never seen a bad head of hair on the ladies here that use it. They use it the way that I did initially, and they also oil their hair before shampooing and as needed. But I have to say that it was Miss Kasey that presented a different approach of using it, to loosen the hair, and for that I am ever grateful and I am so glad she shared, because I may never have thought of this. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Happy Hair Growing everybody /images/graemlins/smile.gif Bonjour.

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

Re: Lovely Secret!

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I am ALWAYS very open to learning from others and sharing my experience with products and techniques etc, (THE GOOD BAD AND THE UGLY! but I would never impose my choices on others. I do not share with the intent or expectation that someone must try it or defend their reasons for not doing so. It's just a post.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you Mahalialee I agree 100%

You answered all my questions and then some! Thank you for such a thorough review of the Henna. I think you have perfected the technique and it seems like a great option for someone who wants to straighten without using relaxers or heat.
Thanks again! maybe I will try it one day down the line when I grow out this permanent color from my hair and have more time to devote to mixing the treatments and moisturising my hair!

It would be nice to go straight for a short time and then be able to revert back to my natural texture without having to go through the pain of growing out a relaxer.

Thanks again
Valleygirl

PS I notice you mentioned that you do a ACV rinse after every wash. Do you feel that this helps with the henna not building up on your hair?

 

[CynamonKis]

Re: Lovely Secret!

Mahalialee, I couldn't agree with you more regarding the use of harmful chemicals! Thanks to you, Kasey, and all of the Ladies that contributed to this very informative thread!

 

[kasey]

Re:Henna Discussion

Sassy and others;

As I mentioned in two other posts, a few years ago I started using the Gold Medal Herbal Tame, www.goldmedalhair.com and I liked the calming effect it had on my hair.It helped to make my hair feel less tangled and more manageable. It also helped to make my hair easier to straighten after the treatment with the use of a blow dryer and a pressing comb.

Last year after I took out my braids I was about to order more HT, but I realized that I could make the HT myself and use the little cash I had on some other GM products. The package of Gold Medal Herbal Tame lists the follwing ingredients: henna, aloe vera, cornsilk, sage, and nettle.

So Sassy, if you are interested in the treatment EITHER make it yourself with a couple of ounces of henna, and a half teaspoon each of aloe vera, cornsilk, sage and nettle OR buy the Gold Medal Herbal Tame at www.goldmedalhair.com.

Henna, Herbal Tame, which ever you use, IS NOT a hair relaxer!!! When I first ordered it, Herbal Tame was marketed as a treatment that CONDITIONS super curly strands AND REDUCES CURL AND BULK to make natural hair more manageable and easier to comb. And it does that very well. So does my home made alternative. I also found that it strengthens my hair and adds body. GM also markets HT as a treatment to condition chemically relaxed hair to help make "new growth" look straighter so relaxed girls can stretch the time between touch ups.

The first half of last year I used the product regularly, about once a month. I think that it helped rebuild my hair after spending a year and some months in extension braids. The henna treatments combined with the knowedge on moisturizing hair from this board has given me very manageable hair. It began to look silky and smooth and straight after simply, rinsing, conditioning and braiding, and unbraiding-no heat. i have not used the treatment for a while, partly because I began wearing my hair wash and wear curly over the summer and partly because the treatment can be messy.

Indian women have been using Henna for years. In my opinion NEUTRAL HENNA treatments USED ONCE EVERY FOUR OR SIX WEEKS on natural hair is no more damaging, drying etc. than other protein conditioners. I have found that it is a good idea to apply a moisturizing conditioner after completely RINSINING the henna treatment out of your hair, just like you do for any other protein conditioner.

Also, I don't think that I and other natural haired folks have "new growth." We just have hair. Henna is not a relaxer. It is a conditioning treatment that also happens to have a mild texturizing effect. The effects are just as cumulative as using a deep conditioner once a month. In my experience henna doesn't "build up" on the hair or permanently alter the texture in the way that a chemical relaxer does. it works just like any other conditioner and temporarly smoothes the cuticles. It just does that much better. When I used henna regularly, I applied the henna treatment to my entire length of hair as you would with any protein conditioner.

Finally this:

Yes, folks who have COLOR treated hair and want to use COLORED HENNA have to BE CARFUL. If you have COLOR TREATED hair and you want to use HENNA to color, you MUST do a patch test.

I have NEVER COLORED MY HAIR or used a COLORED HENNA so, I don't know much about that process.

However, here is a web site that might shed more info on the use of COLORED HENNA TO COLOR YOUR HAIR.

http://reverndbunny.sphosting.com/hair.htm

 

[sassygirl125]

Re:Henna Discussion

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Herbal Tame was marketed as a treatment that CONDITIONS super curly strands AND REDUCES CURL AND BULK to make natural hair more manageable and easier to comb.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Kasey and Mahailialee--
This is exactly the effect I want. Being able to run my fingers through my hair when it's completely dry would be nice! /images/graemlins/wink.gif My Korean beauty supply sells Hennalucent and Surya (sp?) and I've always been interested in trying them out for color. I had no idea henna could make my hair more manageable, too. When I am fully natural I will definitely be trying out the homemade herbal tame mixture. (The homemade version sounds cheaper than the Gold Medal product...)
Thanks again for the info.

 

[iris]

Re: Lovely Secret!

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I have done thorough research on henna IN THE PAST and will continue to do so. We have a large Indian community here, and I have never seen a bad head of hair on the ladies here that use it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mahalialee you have had the same observation that I have about Indian women and their hair. This is another MAJOR reason I decided to look into henna /images/graemlins/smile.gif Indian women along with other cultures, have been using it since time immemorial and I have yet to see a jacked-up head of Indian hair. They have some of the longest, strongest, silkiest, thick hair around. And I reasoned if it is treating their hair that good, I think I'll try it and see for myself /images/graemlins/grin.gif. I'm soooooooo glad I did!

Iris

 

[Mahalialee4]

Re: Lovely Secret!

Valleygirl:

I think yes, that the AVC (acid) does make a difference. Also washing every three days, conditioning etc. contributes to the fading process of the henna. Bonjour. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

Re: Lovely Secret!

Thanks again Mahalialee!!!

Valleygirl

 

[VALLEYGIRL]

Re:Henna Discussion

Wow thanks Kasey! That was also very thorough and informative.

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
It began to look silky and smooth and straight after simply, rinsing, conditioning and braiding, and unbraiding-no heat.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the part that I like....like I said before, maybe one day...
Thanks again
Valleygirl

 

[Mahalialee4]

Re: Lovely Secret!

Iris: A little secret: I have it on authority from some Indian ladies. Some of them have quite unruly hair...it is not all super straight. /images/graemlins/shocked.gif /images/graemlins/laugh.gif SOME hair that looks straight is ACTUALLY VERY CURLY and That is why SOME of them use oil and henna so religiously to smooth it and keep it straight looking! /images/graemlins/wink.gifOn some henna plus other herbal powders packets, it says, that it "keeps the hair straight!" /images/graemlins/grin.gif When I buy the hair conditioning powders in the plastic jars, that has henna, shikakai, reetha, amla, it says this. Aha, so there it is. /images/graemlins/laugh.gifBonjour.

 

[Mahalialee4]

Have you seen this great website!!!!!

http://r.searchhippo.com/r3.php?i=1&amp;q=east+indian+women+with+curly+hair&amp;u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.texturedhairgrowth.com%2F

I just had to share this right away!!!! /images/graemlins/smile.gifWhat do you think about the info? Bonjour.