Is the Devil in Charge of Hell?

[blazingthru]

I would say use proper Biblical hermeneutics (the study and interpretation of Scripture is called hermeneutics). This is something even Protestants teach.

Oddly, I earned a minor in Biblical Studies from a Protestant Evangelical university .

"Let the Bible explain" itself unfortunately is a roundabout way of saying "read and interpret based on your own judgment." I have encountered homosexuals who will quote Scripture to try and prove their lifestyles were not sinful (they would quote St. Paul and argue that he condemned temple prostitution and not gay sex, for example).

So I would caution everyone to be careful with your hermeneutics .

Blazingthru rejects that the soul exists after death (immortality), and wrongly confuses God's eternal nature with immortality (the angels are immortal, but are not divine, so immortality isn't solely an attribute of God).

I believe she also wrongly goes against, due to her particular denomination, against every Christian teaching for 2,000 years, even among Protestants, asserts that Hell is not eternal and that souls will only suffer temporarily before going out of existence.

Yes, I would agree. I totally reject, based on my own studies. Eternal Damnation. Completely totally without hesitation reject as well as any teachings that come out of the Catholic Faith. Any and all. That being said doesn't mean I don't respect Catholic's, I do not harbor any animosity towards those of the catholic faith, If it wasn't for the kindest of the Nuns I would not have finished high school or received some of the help that I needed at the times in which they were desperately sought. I grew up Baptist and Methodist and I reject those teachings as well, some of it I Kept because most faiths have some of the truth but not all. Yes that is correct Hell is not Eternal and the people, because body and soul is one thing, not separate things, without the breath of life your just a body. with the breath of life you are body and soul. (not a spirit) Nope. Those people who are lost with the fallen Angels and Satan will all perish in the lake of fire and will no longer have a part in the new life evermore. They can't burn forever, because this earth is where they will burn, and we the saints will see this and they will be ash and we will walk over it. as the grass grows and the trees bloom after a while they will be forever forgotten by everyone accept our lord and savior.

I believe we have our own walk with God and as we study the bible and we are sincere, God reveals more and more of himself to us and many chose to walk away from the faith they were raised in because they no longer agree with the teachings. I however, chose my faith based on my own personal studies, My studies created a desire in me to find a church that was following the scriptures and obeying them. It was not an easy decisions, i used the forum to help me make the decision. So my faith has not influence me. I study the bible before I even knew what a Seventh Day Adventist was. Regardless when I make my case, I use the scriptures, not some teachings from the SDA although as of yet, i have yet to find a teaching from them that disagrees with the scriptures. But sometimes, The point I am trying to make sounds better coming from a different source then myself as I am a horrible writer.

 

[Galadriel]

Our soul will be spending eternity somewhere, that's certain.

Agreed, MrsHaseeb

I think one of the dangers in this is that some people will see going to Hell as "not that bad" if they just have to suffer for a certain time and then be annihilated. Certainly those in Hell wish for annihilation in comparison to enduring Hell forever.

 

[Galadriel]

Yes, I would agree. I totally reject, based on my own studies. Eternal Damnation. Completely totally without hesitation reject as well as any teachings that come out of the Catholic Faith. Any and all. That being said doesn't mean I don't respect Catholic's, I do not harbor any animosity towards those of the catholic faith, If it wasn't for the kindest of the Nuns I would not have finished high school or received some of the help that I needed at the times in which they were desperately sought. I grew up Baptist and Methodist and I reject those teachings as well,

I have family members who are Methodist My grandmother is SDA.

some of it I Kept because most faiths have some of the truth but not all. Yes that is correct Hell is not Eternal and the people, because body and soul is one thing, not separate things, without the breath of life your just a body. with the breath of life you are body and soul. (not a spirit) Nope

.

Our physical body and our soul are connected while we are alive, but death separates the soul and body--they are two separate things.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Agreed, MrsHaseeb

I think one of the dangers in this is that some people will see going to Hell as "not that bad" if they just have to suffer for a certain time and then be annihilated. Certainly those in Hell wish for annihilation in comparison to enduring Hell forever.

Amen. I just want to be on the right side of this. God is to be feared. People seem to really believe that a "loving God" will not send someone to hell for forever ... All I can say is I need his mercy and grace now to purify me as Christ was pure because it will be a sad thing to die and find out you'll be in a lake burning with fire and brimstone for eternity.
2 Peter 1:10-11 KJV
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: [11] For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

 

[AtlantaJJ]

Amen. I just want to be on the right side of this. God is to be feared. People seem to really believe that a "loving God" will not send someone to hell for forever ... All I can say is I need his mercy and grace now to purify me as Christ was pure because it will be a sad thing to die and find out you'll be in a lake burning with fire and brimstone for eternity.
2 Peter 1:10-11 KJV
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: [11] For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Thank you for posting this, I just re-read 2 Peter 1 - It is so powerful, and it's the answer for everyone who desires to be on the right side!

My love and appreciation for my Lord Jesus' mighty work increases by the day, the more I read and study the Word, it's incredible!

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Thank you for posting this, I just re-read 2 Peter 1 - It is so powerful, and it's the answer for everyone who desires to be on the right side!

My love and appreciation for my Lord Jesus' mighty work increases by the day, the more I read and study the Word, it's incredible!

I think all saints of God have a deeper appreciation for God's Word and want to study more, especially after the Bible series aired, lol.

 

[Shimmie]

I'm still catching up on this thread topic which is phenonminal.

In the meantime, I am 'thanking' (via the thanks buttons) everyone for coming in to share in sweetvi 's thread. I think it's very special and loving of each of you.

If I've missed any 'thanks' buttons, I'll go back and correct it.

Just wanted to share love and appreciation to each of you for being in here.

That's all.

:blowkiss:

 

[Galadriel]

My love and appreciation for my Lord Jesus' mighty work increases by the day, the more I read and study the Word, it's incredible!

Agreed!

 

[sweetvi]

Thanks everyone!

 

[Nice & Wavy]

And my disagreement lies with the particular doctrines that reject the immortality of the soul and a non-eternal Hell, and not with @blazingthru personally.

Jehovah's Witnesses for example, on the claim they are using Scripture to interpret Scripture, reject the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus.

About 3-4 months ago someone argued here in CF that Jesus and the archangel Michael were the same person--and they pulled out their Scripture verses to support their claim.

So I would definitely say that just because someone says, "I believe X because look at Scriptures 1, 2, and 3" doesn't automatically mean that person's interpretation is correct or that X is correct.

It should raise a red flag for us that the Christians who lived with and knew the Apostles themselves, taught an eternal Hell, but someone comes along 1,800+ years later saying Scripture REALLY teaches that Hell is not eternal.

It also raises a red flag for me that the Gnostics taught that Hell is not eternal, because the Gnostics also denied Jesus' divinity, taught Dualism, that the God of the Old Testament was evil, and that you should kill yourself to release your pure soul from your evil body.

Yes, I would agree. I totally reject, based on my own studies. Eternal Damnation. Completely totally without hesitation reject as well as any teachings that come out of the Catholic Faith. Any and all. That being said doesn't mean I don't respect Catholic's, I do not harbor any animosity towards those of the catholic faith, If it wasn't for the kindest of the Nuns I would not have finished high school or received some of the help that I needed at the times in which they were desperately sought. I grew up Baptist and Methodist and I reject those teachings as well, some of it I Kept because most faiths have some of the truth but not all. Yes that is correct Hell is not Eternal and the people, because body and soul is one thing, not separate things, without the breath of life your just a body. with the breath of life you are body and soul. (not a spirit) Nope. Those people who are lost with the fallen Angels and Satan will all perish in the lake of fire and will no longer have a part in the new life evermore.

They can't burn forever, because this earth is where they will burn, and we the saints will see this and they will be ash and we will walk over it.

as the grass grows and the trees bloom after a while they will be forever forgotten by everyone accept our lord and savior.

I believe we have our own walk with God and as we study the bible and we are sincere, God reveals more and more of himself to us and many chose to walk away from the faith they were raised in because they no longer agree with the teachings. I however, chose my faith based on my own personal studies, My studies created a desire in me to find a church that was following the scriptures and obeying them. It was not an easy decisions, i used the forum to help me make the decision. So my faith has not influence me. I study the bible before I even knew what a Seventh Day Adventist was. Regardless when I make my case, I use the scriptures, not some teachings from the SDA although as of yet, i have yet to find a teaching from them that disagrees with the scriptures. But sometimes, The point I am trying to make sounds better coming from a different source then myself as I am a horrible writer.

I'm sorry, blazing...please expound on this. I have never heard of this in my life as a believer and minister of the gospel.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Poohbear]

Are we then to understand that God's kindgom is not everlasting (aionion)? That it somehow ends in duration as is being suggested? Will our existence in Heaven end or be temporary since eternal life is spoken of, using the Greek aionion?

This is the question that came to my mind after reading those websites. I started thinking how can they say Hell isn't eternal and Heaven is eternal?

 

[Laela]

If we know and believe for good, there is bad; up, there is down; in, there is out; dry, there is wet; cold there is hot....then certainly if heaven is eternal, so is hell.... or am I reaching?

 

[Nice & Wavy]

If we know and believe for good, there is bad; up, there is down; in, there is out; dry, there is wet; cold there is hot....then certainly if heaven is eternal, so is hell.... or am I reaching?

Nope...

 

[Galadriel]

If we know and believe for good, there is bad; up, there is down; in, there is out; dry, there is wet; cold there is hot....then certainly if heaven is eternal, so is hell.... or am I reaching?

I think the principle here is that God has not and will not undo our existence (physical death is just the separation of soul and body, not the end of our existence). If existence continues for the saints in Heaven, then existence clearly continues for the damned--in Hell.

Heaven is populated right now by the holy angels and the saints. Hell is populated by the apostate angels (demons) and the damned.

Remember what Hebrews 9:27 says, "It is appointed for men to die once, and then comes the judgment."

We will all have our own particular judgment at the moment of our death. The General Judgment is when Christ returns to publicly judge the living and the dead.

 

[blazingthru]

I'm sorry, blazing...please expound on this. I have never heard of this in my life as a believer and minister of the gospel.

Thanks in advance.

Luke 16:19-31 Series of five parables: the lost coin, the lost sheep, the lost son, unjust steward, rich man and Lazarus. -
Abraham's bosom would need to be quite large to fit men into it -
Dip of the finger, one drop of water will not be enough to cool him - Conversations between heaven and hell - how blissful could heaven be if you could hear the cries of the lost from hell? -Who is He speaking to? vs 14 The Pharisees, lovers of money. They believed that if you were rich you were blessed by God and if you were poor you were cursed. They always prided themselves on being “related” to Abraham - John 8:39,44 -In the parable the rich man goes to hell and the poor beggar goes to heaven. -The rich man addresses Abraham as “Father Abraham” just like the pharisees called Abraham father in John 8:39. -The rich man represents the pharisees. Jesus is challenging their thinking about money. -The beggar represents the gentiles (Matthew 15:21-27) beggars eating crumbs. - Matthew 21:31 even the tax collectors and harlots will enter the Kingdom before you. -What was Jesus trying to teach in this parable? -The importance of witnessing. Israel failed to warn the gentile world and they were guilty of their death. You only have one life to live.

Hell is the grave, The Grave. The entire theory of souls burning forever comes from a parable and if you can't accept that it’s a parable, well it will be very difficult to understand that Hell is the grave. But the fact of the matter is that, that is what hell is a Grave

2 Peter 3:10 (KJV 1900)

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

That being said, let’s go to Jeremiah where he talks about the condition of the earth after Jesus has come and removed all the saints, which is called the First Resurrection. There are TWO. Of course this is where people get confused, they think this is the time where they have a second chance, but nowhere in scripture is that found.

As you read below, the earth is now back to where it was originally, void, dark, abyss. No light, no human. Because they died at the coming of the lord. Those beings that died were the lost. The rest of the dead that were lost remains in their graves and now the earth is a Grave. Because the only thing that is still here is the dead lost.

Jeremiah 4:23–26
23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; And the heavens, and they had no light. 24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, And all the hills moved lightly. 25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man,

Isaiah 24:1
Behold, the Lord maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, And turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.

Isaiah 24:3

The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: For the Lord hath spoken this word.

Isaiah 11:4. With the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

2 Thessalonians 1:7, 8. When the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God.

Psalms 68:2. Let the wicked perish at the presence of God

Revelation 20:5. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

Jeremiah 25:33
33 And the slain of the Lord shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: They shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; They shall be dung upon the ground.

Jeremiah 4:25
25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, And all the birds of the heavens were fled.

Luke 17:37 speaks of the bodies of the wicked and mentions the vultures gathered around them Revelation 19:17, 18 The wicked who are left behind at Christ's coming are left dead.

there is no suggestion in the texts that the "soul" is cast in at one time and the "body" at another. The immortal-soul doctrine, by defining "soul" as the real man and the body as but a fleshly prison house, really asks us to believe that the real man goes immediately at death to hellfire, and then at some distant future date God raises the body, which has turned to dust, and consigns it to the fires. We avoid such an irrational and un-Scriptural conclusion by understanding the phrase "soul and body" to mean the whole person, viewed physically and mentally in his entirety, “the whole body." But when are persons cast bodily into the judgment fires? At the last great judgment day, when the wicked dead who have been raised, and who have been judged guilty, are "cast into the lake of fire." (See Rev. 20:11-15.)
The word for "bottomless pit" in the original Greek is "abussos," or abyss. That same word is used in the Greek version of the Old Testament in Genesis 1:2 in connection with the creation of the earth, but there it is translated "deep." "The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. The words "deep," "bottomless pit," and "abyss" here refer to the same thing--the earth in its totally dark, disorganized form before God made order of it. Jeremiah, in describing this earth during the 1,000 years, used virtually the same terms as these in Genesis 1:2: "without form and void," "no light," "no man," 'black." Jeremiah 4:23, 25, 28. So the battered, dark earth with no people alive will be called the bottomless pit, or abyss, during the 1,000 years just as it was in the beginning before Creation was completed. Isaiah 24:22 also speaks of Satan and his angels during the 1,000 years as "gathered in the pit" and "shut up in the prison."
So while the saints are in heaven reviewing the books, Judgment is being made over the lost. The saints will remain in heaven for 1,000.00 years.

Revelation 20:4 (KJV 1900)
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them:

1 Corinthians 6:2 (KJV 1900)
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
The new Jerusalem comes down to rest on the earth which is now flatten and is a plain. The dead lost are now awake, those who have lived since the beginning of the creation of the earth. All men that were not saved are now awaken.

Revelation 21:2 (KJV 1900)
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

Zechariah 14:4 (KJV 1900)
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, Which is before Jerusalem on the east, And the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, And there shall be a very great valley; And half of the mountain ... The new Jerusalem will settle where the mount of Olives now stands. The mountain will be flattened to make a great plain, upon which the city will come to rest.

Revelation 20:5
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the resurrection of the damn.

Revelation 20:7–9
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city.
"Fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Revelation 20:10 (KJV 1900)
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.... Which just means until it is now ash.

Malachi 4:3
3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; For they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet In the day that I shall do this, saith the Lord of hosts.

Isaiah 65:17 (KJV 1900)
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: And the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Isaiah 47:14 (KJV 1900)
14 Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; They shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: There shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it.

Revelation 21:1 (KJV 1900)
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 Peter 3:13 (KJV 1900)
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:3 (KJV 1900)
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Revelation 21:4 (KJV 1900)
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. Here the scripture says the former things are passed away.

 

[blazingthru]

Death, Not Eternal Torment
The Bible tells us that "the wages of sin is" not eternal life in hellfire, but "death" (Romans 6:23), the same penalty God assured Adam and Eve would be theirs if they ate the forbidden fruit.

Ezekiel states clearly that "the soul that sinneth, it shall die" (Ezekiel 18:4), and a plethora of other Bible verses and passages endorse this position. The prophet Malachi wrote that sinners would burn up as "stubble" and would become "ashes under the soles" of the feet of the redeemed (Malachi 4:1, 3). Even the final fate of Satan is explicitly pronounced in Ezekiel 28:18, where the Bible says that the enemy of souls will be reduced to ashes upon the "earth." Compare that with Psalm 37:10 ("For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be"), Psalm 68:2 ("as wax melteth before the fire, so let the wicked perish at the presence of God"), and other similar verses. Soon you get a clear picture that the purpose of the fires of hell is to eradicate sin and to expunge the universe of its awful presence.

Interestingly, it was the devil who was first to suggest that sinners would not die (Genesis 3:4). A hell where sinners never perish would prove the devil right and would make God, who told Eve she would "surely die" as a result of transgression (Genesis 2:17), a liar.

 

[Nice & Wavy]

You know what...nevermind.

Thanks for thanking my post, Laela...I've decided to remove it for a good reason!

 

[Iwanthealthyhair67]

Oh wow.......

 

[sweetvi]

I must of missed something that was deleted, but I hope this thread can continue and did not intend for any conflicts!

 

[blazingthru]

Hiya sweetvi, Jesus' death, descension to hell, resurrection and ascension to the Father, serves as the guide. I believe both to be eternal states for man after death because that's what the Bible says.

"And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels ..." -Matt 25: 40-41

On the cross, Jesus promised eternal life to the man being hung with Him who believed: "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise" - Luke 23:43

I just want to mentioned that Jesus did not go to "Paradise" he went into the grave, He Died. He lay in the earth for three days. Actually Jews note that anytime in a day is consider a full day. Nonetheless, he laid in the grave and was awaken and went out among the people, he was here what forty days before he ascended to heaven? Yes forty days. So obviously, he could not have meant today, this day! he meant this is a promise to you, that I make today.
Where is paradise
Revelation 2:7
King James Version (KJV)
7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
Revelation 22:1-2
King James Version (KJV)
22 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

Then we see Jesus talking with Mary, who wanted to hug him and cling to him.
John 20:17 (KJV 1900)
17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren,

Better yet, what does the thief say, He totally understood what Jesus was saying. He said Remember me.

 

[dicapr]

Agreed, MrsHaseeb

I think one of the dangers in this is that some people will see going to Hell as "not that bad" if they just have to suffer for a certain time and then be annihilated. Certainly those in Hell wish for annihilation in comparison to enduring Hell forever.

I think this is why the concept of eternal hell is held on to so tightly-for the fear factor of it. Eternal punishment seems much more prohibitive then eternal death. But I must say that eternal death highlights the finality and mercy of God at the end of this age. As long as there is eternal punishment the reign of sin and its consequences will be before us. How can paradise be enjoyed along side eternal torment?How can God move forward from the reign of sin if forever if his wayward creations cries of torment are ever before him. To me eternal death is about the finality of this chapter in earths history. God promises death in the garden on Eden. Death denotes a finality that eternal punishment does not. Besides, those of us who love God with our whole heart and mind should find the idea of being separated from our Lord and Savior enough of a deterrent. God doesn't was our devotion out of fear.

 

[Galadriel]

I think this is why the concept of eternal hell is held on to so tightly-for the fear factor of it. Eternal punishment seems much more prohibitive then eternal death. But I must say that eternal death highlights the finality and mercy of God at the end of this age. As long as there is eternal punishment the reign of sin and its consequences will be before us. How can paradise be enjoyed along side eternal torment?How can God move forward from the reign of sin if forever if his wayward creations cries of torment are ever before him. To me eternal death is about the finality of this chapter in earths history. God promises death in the garden on Eden. Death denotes a finality that eternal punishment does not. Besides, those of us who love God with our whole heart and mind should find the idea of being separated from our Lord and Savior enough of a deterrent. God doesn't was our devotion out of fear.

I think the Apostolic Fathers (the Overseers who worked with the Apostles and knew them personally) are a great start because their writings show what the Apostles handed down to Christians on this matter Other heavyweights of course are Saint Augustine, Saint Thomas Aquinas, who are among the greatest Christian scholars & theologians to have ever lived.

If you do a historical survey of the belief of a non-eternal Hell, you'll find that early heretical sects (Gnostics) taught this, and it disappeared until the 19th/20th Century with Seventh Day Adventists, etc. Eastern Orthodox, Protestant, and Catholic Christians have unanimously held to the dogma that Hell is eternal.

While it certainly is terrible to contemplate an eternity in Hell, what should motivate our service to God is love. God Himself became flesh and died for our sins (and how poignant to say this on Good Friday, no less!). God is also very willing to give us the grace we need to grow closer to Him.

I am a Christian not because I'm afraid of Hell, but because I want to know how to live, I want to know Truth, I want to know God, and I want to fulfill my purpose of loving Him and spending a happy eternity with Him. Anyone in Hell is there because he or she rejected God and died unrepentant.

Does it suck to go to Hell for eternity? You bet.

Which is exactly why God wills that we be saved, and gave us Jesus Christ as the Way.

But we must cooperate. We can't be ushered through the gates of Heaven against our will.

And we certainly can't enter the presence of the Holy One in a state of rebellion.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Matthew 25:40-41 KJV
And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. [41] Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

I don't know if this Scripture has been posted, but the word here for everlasting literally means without beginning and without end... The point is, everlasting fire was not prepared for man, but for the devil and his angels. So those manipulated by the devil end up there with Him. It says what it says, there is no need to come up with all these interpretations about why hell is not eternal. Lets focus on being in Christ Jesus and being a light to others so that we and those who will can be saved from God's wrath.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

While it certainly is terrible to contemplate an eternity in Hell, what should motivate our service to God is love. God Himself became flesh and died for our sins (and how poignant to say this on Good Friday, no less!). God is also very willing to give us the grace we need to grow closer to Him.

I am a Christian not because I'm afraid of Hell, but because I want to know how to live, I want to know Truth, I want to know God, and I want to fulfill my purpose of loving Him and spending a happy eternity with Him. Anyone in Hell is there because he or she rejected God and died unrepentant.

Does it suck to go to Hell for eternity? You bet.

Which is exactly why God wills that we be saved, and gave us Jesus Christ as the Way.

But we must cooperate. We can't be ushered through the gates of Heaven against our will.

And we certainly can't enter the presence of the Holy One in a state of rebellion.

Girl... Just tell the truth...

When I was crying out and repenting to God to restore my pitiful backslidden self over a year ago it wasn't because of hell. I just knew I needed Him.

 

[MrsHaseeb]

Matthew 8:28-29 KJV
And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. [29] And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?

I don't know if this has been posted either, but we have to remember that the devil is an angelic being (although evil) so a burning earth would have no effect on him. Based on these verses, devils believe that there is a time coming where they will be tormented.

I suppose I need to read through the thread.

 

[dicapr]

I think the Apostolic Fathers (the Overseers who worked with the Apostles and knew them personally) are a great start because their writings show what the Apostles handed down to Christians on this matter Other heavyweights of course are Saint Augustine, Saint Thomas Aquinas, who are among the greatest Christian scholars & theologians to have ever lived.

If you do a historical survey of the belief of a non-eternal Hell, you'll find that early heretical sects (Gnostics) taught this, and it disappeared until the 19th/20th Century with Seventh Day Adventists, etc. Eastern Orthodox, Protestant, and Catholic Christians have unanimously held to the dogma that Hell is eternal.

While it certainly is terrible to contemplate an eternity in Hell, what should motivate our service to God is love. God Himself became flesh and died for our sins (and how poignant to say this on Good Friday, no less!). God is also very willing to give us the grace we need to grow closer to Him.

I am a Christian not because I'm afraid of Hell, but because I want to know how to live, I want to know Truth, I want to know God, and I want to fulfill my purpose of loving Him and spending a happy eternity with Him. Anyone in Hell is there because he or she rejected God and died unrepentant.

Does it suck to go to Hell for eternity? You bet.

Which is exactly why God wills that we be saved, and gave us Jesus Christ as the Way.

But we must cooperate. We can't be ushered through the gates of Heaven against our will.

And we certainly can't enter the presence of the Holy One in a state of rebellion.

I can understand why many feel from the bible that he'll is eternal. It wasn't until I was shown in the bible how the expression forever is used several places that best translates until completion that I was able to see hell as finite. For me the most convincing argument is that God promised death as the wage of sin and not an eternity of punishment. One of the statements isn't true. While hell can be debates on theological study the bible clearly states that wages of sin is death. Truthfully, it is one of those theological points that will only be proven without a doubt when Jesus returns. So long as we make it to heaven what happens to the wicked wont concern us anyway.

 

[Galadriel]

Lets focus on being in Christ Jesus and being a light to others so that we and those who will can be saved from God's wrath.

Well said MrsHaseeb

 

[blazingthru]

Matthew 8:28-29 KJV
And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. [29] And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?

I don't know if this has been posted either, but we have to remember that the devil is an angelic being (although evil) so a burning earth would have no effect on him. Based on these verses, devils believe that there is a time coming where they will be tormented.

I suppose I need to read through the thread.

But the word of God says the fire will begin inside of the devil, he will burn inside outward. God is the creator and he can destroy the devil with fire. The devil is not Eternal. He is not all powerful and all knowing. He was a servant of God. He can be destroyed as will the demons or fallen angels. They tremble at their punishment. Do not think that they are not afraid they are very afraid. The Devil has known from the garden of Eden or dare I say the outskirts of Eden that his head will be bruised, He knew then that his time is short. His greatest pleasure is how many humans can he take with him.

Ezekiel 28:16-19 (New American Standard Bible)
16 “By the abundance of your trade
[a]You were internally filled with violence,
And you sinned;
Therefore I have cast you as profane
From the mountain of God.
And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub,
From the midst of the stones of fire.
17 “Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor.
I cast you to the ground;
I put you before kings,
That they may see you.
18 “By the multitude of your iniquities,
In the unrighteousness of your trade
You profaned your sanctuaries.
Therefore I have brought fire from the midst of you;
It has consumed you,
And I have turned you to ashes on the earth
In the eyes of all who see you.
19 “All who know you among the peoples
Are appalled at you;
You have become [c]terrified
And you will cease to be forever.”’”

Malachi 4:1 (KJV 1900)
For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; And all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: And the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, That it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Malachi 4:3 (KJV 1900)
3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; For they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet In the day that I shall do this, saith the Lord of hosts.

 

[divya]

Wonderful thread. Understanding the truth about hell reveals much about the character of God. God loves His creations so much that we are given the opportunity to choose or reject eternity with Him.

Even if we reject Him, He will not make us suffer endlessly. The verse puts it simply and clearly.

Romans 3:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Additionally, the Scriptures do teach us that we are not immortal. The soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:20

Only when Christ returns to raise the dead in Him and those living in Him, will believers and only believers be given immortality.

I Cor. 5:51-55

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

 

[blazingthru]

“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.” Isaiah 8:20. The people of God are directed to the Scriptures as their safeguard against the influence of false teachers and the delusive power of spirits of darkness. Satan employs every possible device to prevent men from obtaining a knowledge of the Bible; for its plain utterances reveal his deceptions. At every revival of God’s work the prince of evil is aroused to more intense activity; he is now putting forth his utmost efforts for a final struggle against Christ and His followers. The last great delusion is soon to open before us. Antichrist is to perform his marvelous works in our sight. So closely will the counterfeit resemble the true that it will be impossible to distinguish between them except by the Holy Scriptures. By their testimony every statement and every miracle must be tested.
Those who endeavor to obey all the commandments of God will be opposed and derided. They can stand only in God. In order to endure the trial before them, they must understand the will of God as revealed in His word; they can honor Him only as they have a right conception of His character, government, and purposes, and act in accordance with them. None but those who have fortified the mind with the truths of the Bible will stand through the last great conflict. To every soul will come the searching test: Shall I obey God rather than men? The decisive hour is even now at hand. Are our feet planted on the rock of God’s immutable word? Are we prepared to stand firm in defense of the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus?
Before His crucifixion the Saviour explained to His disciples that He was to be put to death and to rise again from the tomb, and angels were present to impress His words on minds and hearts. But the disciples were looking for temporal deliverance from the Roman yoke, and they could not tolerate the thought that He in whom all their hopes centered should suffer an ignominious death. The words which they needed to remember were banished from their minds; and when the time of trial came, it found them unprepared. The death of Jesus as fully destroyed their hopes as if He had not forewarned them. So in the prophecies the future is opened before us as plainly as it was opened to the disciples by the words of Christ. The events connected with the close of probation and the work of preparation for the time of trouble, are clearly presented. But multitudes have no more understanding of these important truths than if they had never been revealed. Satan watches to catch away every impression that would make them wise unto salvation, and the time of trouble will find them unready.
When God sends to men warnings so important that they are represented as proclaimed by holy angels flying in the midst of heaven, He requires every person endowed with reasoning powers to heed the message. The fearful judgments denounced against the worship of the beast and his image (Revelation 14:9-11), should lead all to a diligent study of the prophecies to learn what the mark of the beast is, and how they are to avoid receiving it. But the masses of the people turn away their ears from hearing the truth and are turned unto fables. The apostle Paul declared, looking down to the last days: “The time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine.” 2 Timothy 4:3. That time has fully come. The multitudes do not want Bible truth, because it interferes with the desires of the sinful, world-loving heart; and Satan supplies the deceptions which they love.
But God will have a people upon the earth to maintain the Bible, and the Bible only, as the standard of all doctrines and the basis of all reforms. The opinions of learned men, the deductions of science, the creeds or decisions of ecclesiastical councils, as numerous and discordant as are the churches which they represent, the voice of the majority—not one nor all of these should be regarded as evidence for or against any point of religious faith. Before accepting any doctrine or precept, we should demand a plain “Thus saith the Lord” in its support. Satan is constantly endeavoring to attract attention to man in the place of God. He leads the people to look to bishops, to pastors, to professors of theology, as their guides, instead of searching the Scriptures to learn their duty for themselves. Then, by controlling the minds of these leaders, he can influence the multitudes according to his will.